Bnr k04-gt28
04-16-2011, 09:22 PM
#1327
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Me personally, Ive never hit 36 at the MAF on the stocker. Id average 32-34 peak. This one was constantly flowing 37-38. That 36 was on the dyno. Anyways, I dont know if I can even trust those numbers anyways since weve already established that it does not flow as we though it would.
04-16-2011, 10:50 PM
#1328
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You have 254KPA at almost 7K rpm's: Thats quite good
Your commanded lambda is .88, but its showing .91 at the wideband: Thats a bit scary at 143 MPH.
Your VE and MAF is flowing quite nicely. What ever you have done since your dyno run, seems to have improved a few things. Just what I gather. I am sure Nick will tweak all this for you when he gets your log.
04-16-2011, 11:52 PM
#1329
Looking at the general log snapshot here is what I gather:
You have 254KPA at almost 7K rpm's: Thats quite good
Your commanded lambda is .88, but its showing .91 at the wideband: Thats a bit scary at 143 MPH.
Your VE and MAF is flowing quite nicely. What ever you have done since your dyno run, seems to have improved a few things. Just what I gather. I am sure Nick will tweak all this for you when he gets your log.
You have 254KPA at almost 7K rpm's: Thats quite good
Your commanded lambda is .88, but its showing .91 at the wideband: Thats a bit scary at 143 MPH.
Your VE and MAF is flowing quite nicely. What ever you have done since your dyno run, seems to have improved a few things. Just what I gather. I am sure Nick will tweak all this for you when he gets your log.
Anyways, my engine has always been a troublemaker and not the norm when it comes to making power like other LNF. Memeber Stamina and I have identical setups except he has the k&n sri and I have the hahn cai. On the same gas here in houston and same conditions his engine was always more tolerant to WOT timing(like most other LNFs) yet mine would KR with anything above 13*. Both of us were on a TF tune. Thats part of the reason I switched to E. So, my engine has always been kinda a bitch to tune. But, the fact that theres another 2860 out there doing the exact same thing cements the idea in my head that its the turbo more than anything else.
04-17-2011, 02:04 AM
#1330
I think you best do some research of real GT2871's and what trim your looking at to hit
450 whp, then go compare it to the trim of the BNR GT2871.
If you want to run a big trim GT2871 for 450 whp, have fun getting full spool up around 4-4.5k rpms.
I can tell just by your comment I've done more research then you on the BNR2871 upgrade. For some reason you gave yourself a false sense of 400whp with the upgrade. I've known from researching Mazda's and Genesis running the same BNR GT2871 upgrade and what the BNR GT2871 was capable of, sorry if you thought this was a 400whp + turbo.
By the way Brain @ BNR rated the BNR GT2871 at 400hp, not wheel horsepower.
450 whp, then go compare it to the trim of the BNR GT2871.
If you want to run a big trim GT2871 for 450 whp, have fun getting full spool up around 4-4.5k rpms.
I can tell just by your comment I've done more research then you on the BNR2871 upgrade. For some reason you gave yourself a false sense of 400whp with the upgrade. I've known from researching Mazda's and Genesis running the same BNR GT2871 upgrade and what the BNR GT2871 was capable of, sorry if you thought this was a 400whp + turbo.
By the way Brain @ BNR rated the BNR GT2871 at 400hp, not wheel horsepower.
no i didn't get want 400 whp.. i thought it should be able to hit close to 400 whp .. on MY car.. a 2.4 .. lol not a 2.0 .. you guys should be able to get like 380 whp on it or so .. i mean **** i only want 350 with a good powerband
not to mention 400+ has been done on the lnf with a 2871 on not a super huge trim.. and not stupid huge boost levels and no combo tune
Last edited by elecblue06; 04-17-2011 at 02:19 AM.
04-17-2011, 07:03 AM
#1332
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EDIT: fixed the BHP comment I made but my thoughts on the whole turbo upgrade still remain.
Thats assuming you do this upgrade with a tune. The power I and others made with this turbo is what I would expect if you just threw this on without a tune. We can push the K04 to make 340-350whp so I assumed that we could do the same to these and make more. But as BYT proved, even at different boost levels it still maxed out at 313.
All Im saying is that I can make this kind of HP with the stock K04. Did I get what I paid for? No, not really. Is it worth the price? No, not really. Like I said earlier. This was an untested product solely based on stock garrett GT28 flowcharts. It looks good on paper but it doesnt translate to the real world. I took a chance hoping for the best and it didnt go so well, thats just how it goes when your the first to tryout something new.
Thats assuming you do this upgrade with a tune. The power I and others made with this turbo is what I would expect if you just threw this on without a tune. We can push the K04 to make 340-350whp so I assumed that we could do the same to these and make more. But as BYT proved, even at different boost levels it still maxed out at 313.
All Im saying is that I can make this kind of HP with the stock K04. Did I get what I paid for? No, not really. Is it worth the price? No, not really. Like I said earlier. This was an untested product solely based on stock garrett GT28 flowcharts. It looks good on paper but it doesnt translate to the real world. I took a chance hoping for the best and it didnt go so well, thats just how it goes when your the first to tryout something new.
04-17-2011, 02:02 PM
#1333
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Here's a screenshot of the log from Pbass' dyno:
Here's a couple pulls overlapped:
The bright green is 16-17psi the other 2 are 22-23psi. I tried everything on this car including cam changes which did help a lil bit up top but still had a spot where it dipped. Again, I did 17 pulls with this car on the dyno, every single one looked like that with changes only before the dip lol. We changed plugs, checked the cat etc.. He is trying a catless dp now for ***** and giggles.
To be fair:
PBass showed me a dyno prior to this and it died hard up top on the stocker as well. So Im still not ruling out some other issue!
Here's a couple pulls overlapped:
The bright green is 16-17psi the other 2 are 22-23psi. I tried everything on this car including cam changes which did help a lil bit up top but still had a spot where it dipped. Again, I did 17 pulls with this car on the dyno, every single one looked like that with changes only before the dip lol. We changed plugs, checked the cat etc.. He is trying a catless dp now for ***** and giggles.
To be fair:
PBass showed me a dyno prior to this and it died hard up top on the stocker as well. So Im still not ruling out some other issue!
It looks like the light green there isn't a dip in power up top. The other higher boost pulls are pulsating. That car running on a stock clutch? It sure looks like that thing isn't getting the power to the ground.
04-17-2011, 02:32 PM
#1334
Yeah Im still on stock clutch but it is NOT slipping. My graph was pretty clean and ran straight across to almost 7k. It doesnt look anything like that ^^^. I know what clutch slip feels like and it is not doing that on the road at all. I know that BNR has had success with these upgrades on other vehicles but it doesnt seem to translate to the LNF.
04-17-2011, 04:36 PM
#1335
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OK, well to add to the good luck pieces, I have ordered a new clutch to add to the catless DP.
Also, if anyone knows, please post a source for a four-leaf clover that's actually in stock and ready for delivery.
Also, if anyone knows, please post a source for a four-leaf clover that's actually in stock and ready for delivery.
04-18-2011, 09:13 AM
#1337
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Only issue there is its WELL past the peak tq area which showed no signs of slipping, so I would say that's very false. Ive also held over 400wtq on several cars now with the stocker and made over 350whp on the stocker too. It's not clutch slip..
Edit: Did a lil research.. Checked BNR phone number - 205 area code = Birmingham, AL. You could just say you are who you are
Last edited by BYT*SS*TURBO; 04-18-2011 at 10:04 AM.
04-18-2011, 09:15 AM
#1338
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Stayed side by side today on the way home after a meet with a new blk Camaro SS
80-130 mph pull on I-65.
This was with me in 4th gear about 4k rpms (remember my gearing is slightly different).
3rd gear at 80 for me puts me right at about 6k (maybe slightly lower) rpms.
My redline is at 7k
We were playing follow the leader and back and forth for about 10 miles before we got to a side by side pull in, he did get a slight head start but I'm not complaining (it was only a split second).
I got a huge thumbs up when he pulled back up next to me and exited at the Cullman exit in Alabama.
For me that is proof enough of how well the BNR GT2871 pulls/flows on the top end, don't forget I'm packing +300 lbs more weight then you Cobalt dudes.
This was on a 93 Octane Trifecta tune.
Wait till I get the relocated MAF tuned and making a intake that can breath better then my stock airbox.
Take it for what its worth, but I promise you no way I could have stayed with a Camaro SS 80-130 pull in my HHR SS with the stock K04.
80-130 mph pull on I-65.
This was with me in 4th gear about 4k rpms (remember my gearing is slightly different).
3rd gear at 80 for me puts me right at about 6k (maybe slightly lower) rpms.
My redline is at 7k
We were playing follow the leader and back and forth for about 10 miles before we got to a side by side pull in, he did get a slight head start but I'm not complaining (it was only a split second).
I got a huge thumbs up when he pulled back up next to me and exited at the Cullman exit in Alabama.
For me that is proof enough of how well the BNR GT2871 pulls/flows on the top end, don't forget I'm packing +300 lbs more weight then you Cobalt dudes.
This was on a 93 Octane Trifecta tune.
Wait till I get the relocated MAF tuned and making a intake that can breath better then my stock airbox.
Take it for what its worth, but I promise you no way I could have stayed with a Camaro SS 80-130 pull in my HHR SS with the stock K04.
04-18-2011, 09:24 AM
#1339
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Um yeah new LS3 vette is a good 700 lbs lighter than the camaro.
04-18-2011, 09:50 AM
#1341
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She is doing well. I was looking for a G8 GXP but I cannot find any within 200 miles of me and the ones I found are way too expensive used. Even the G8 GTs are way expensive for being used. Might get a new 4 dr. GMC or Chevy pickup with the 6.2L and the 6L80E and 4wd. 2wd truck is pointless to me.
04-18-2011, 09:59 AM
#1342
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04-18-2011, 10:11 AM
#1344
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424 * 15% = 360whp in a heavier car. I know what happened and not to mention, a street race is open to so many variables that again, not a good judge of anything. Ive seen much faster cars lose to better drivers, happens ALL the time.
Take it to the track and trap over 120, THAT will be a good judge OR are you going to CED? Ill gladly give you a try at my car...
Take it to the track and trap over 120, THAT will be a good judge
OR are you going to CED? Ill gladly give you a try at my car...
04-18-2011, 10:24 AM
#1345
Stamina and I have both taken on new camaro ss's and beat them. That was on the stock k04 and a 24 psi tune. When I was on BYTs e blend tune on the stock turbo it wsas even faster. For some reason the only car I wasn't able to match up with before on the stock turbo was an srt8 charger.
04-18-2011, 10:49 AM
#1347
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Some stock times for you from the corvette forum
2008 Cp. Stock A6 2.56 gears... Best et - 60ft = 1.879...1/8 = 7.81@ 92.91...1/4 = 12.01@ 118.97
i ran 12.16 but i have the 2.73
Originally Posted by KyleBst264
On average what's the 1/4 mile times from a showroom stock LS3 with a 2.56 rear end gear and A6 trans?
The short answer? The average time is FAST!
Seriously though, it will depend on a few things such as track prep, weather conditions, other vehicle options and even coolant temps but they've been running anywhere from 12.1s on up to 12.4s at anywhere from 114mph on up to 116mph regardless of whether they have the 2.56s or the 2.73s.
It took a while but the LS3s finally beat my LS2's best stock time (still the quickest stock LS2).
Conditions must have been really favorable for you.
I know your Cobalt SS/TC is fast and not knocking that it isn't, that LS3 vette should have ate your lunch 100+ mph and probably sooner when the K04 starts falling off in power.
I saw a 30 whp fall off from 5.25k to 7k rpms on the stock K04 on my dyno graph that I dyno'd last year.
2008 Cp. Stock A6 2.56 gears... Best et - 60ft = 1.879...1/8 = 7.81@ 92.91...1/4 = 12.01@ 118.97
i ran 12.16 but i have the 2.73
Originally Posted by KyleBst264
On average what's the 1/4 mile times from a showroom stock LS3 with a 2.56 rear end gear and A6 trans?
The short answer? The average time is FAST!
Seriously though, it will depend on a few things such as track prep, weather conditions, other vehicle options and even coolant temps but they've been running anywhere from 12.1s on up to 12.4s at anywhere from 114mph on up to 116mph regardless of whether they have the 2.56s or the 2.73s.
It took a while but the LS3s finally beat my LS2's best stock time (still the quickest stock LS2).
Conditions must have been really favorable for you.
I know your Cobalt SS/TC is fast and not knocking that it isn't, that LS3 vette should have ate your lunch 100+ mph and probably sooner when the K04 starts falling off in power.
I saw a 30 whp fall off from 5.25k to 7k rpms on the stock K04 on my dyno graph that I dyno'd last year.
I am running Ethanol and the power barely drops. I like that you're hung up on my story which Im not bragging about lol. Just comparing and saying that isn't a good judge, goto the track or another dyno. Just saying your car is X fast because it beats X car means nothing, sorry.
04-18-2011, 11:35 AM
#1349
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Gee, I wonder who this is.. Prolly the person that responded to both customers with: Looks like clutch slip, not the turbo.
Only issue there is its WELL past the peak tq area which showed no signs of slipping, so I would say that's very false. Ive also held over 400wtq on several cars now with the stocker and made over 350whp on the stocker too. It's not clutch slip..
Edit: Did a lil research.. Checked BNR phone number - 205 area code = Birmingham, AL. You could just say you are who you are
Only issue there is its WELL past the peak tq area which showed no signs of slipping, so I would say that's very false. Ive also held over 400wtq on several cars now with the stocker and made over 350whp on the stocker too. It's not clutch slip..
Edit: Did a lil research.. Checked BNR phone number - 205 area code = Birmingham, AL. You could just say you are who you are
I understand your confidence in your tuning and you may be a great tuner. All the logs look great and the lines are consistant on the datalogs. If there is a tuning problem, it will show on the datalogs as well as the dyno sheet. The MAF readings don't osculate like the dyno graphs at higher boost levels so it is not the tune making the dip. This is very evident that there is some slippage.
04-18-2011, 11:45 AM
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Im just going by the fact you are sticking to the same story you did in emails and nobody else has mentioned that lol. Care to just say you are who you are? lol..
If the clutch was slipping, the boost and the load would drop off hard when it does. I tune these frequently and know what it looks like. Again, it makes no sense the clutch would start slipping after its well beyond the peak tq area and had showed no sign of slipping there. This turbo isn't nearly as responsive or harsh on immediate tq like the stocker is. Which is what causes the stock clutches to slip, immediate high levels of tq.
Just look at Cuban's graph, line is dead flat and shows no sign of slippage. Just not making what is advertised. These things happen when trying new things out. Nobody is attacking anyone here, just stating it isn't performing as expected so beware to the customer.
Edit: That and the obvious, your only posts are in this thread lol.... 4 posts all in the BNR thread.
If the clutch was slipping, the boost and the load would drop off hard when it does. I tune these frequently and know what it looks like. Again, it makes no sense the clutch would start slipping after its well beyond the peak tq area and had showed no sign of slipping there. This turbo isn't nearly as responsive or harsh on immediate tq like the stocker is. Which is what causes the stock clutches to slip, immediate high levels of tq.
Just look at Cuban's graph, line is dead flat and shows no sign of slippage. Just not making what is advertised. These things happen when trying new things out. Nobody is attacking anyone here, just stating it isn't performing as expected so beware to the customer.
Edit: That and the obvious, your only posts are in this thread lol.... 4 posts all in the BNR thread.
Last edited by BYT*SS*TURBO; 04-18-2011 at 11:52 AM.