elecblue06

iTrader: (1)

i find this amusing.. YOU'RE missing it man.. I said you guys made about 30 whp with your full setup then people do with everything ASIDE from head and cams. so i'm taking out the tune and bolt ons. you guys made roughly 30 whp more .. then cars with bolt ons and tunes.. thats what i'm going off of.. just about everyone on here knows tunes account for large gains . I'm not delusional enough to think that ported head and cams will make 100hp on all setups.. but i dont see how 30 hp is out of the question.. thats approximately what was done on the stock turbo. You of all people should know when things are more efficient gains are made.. more efficient turbo.. with said head package should result in similar gains to the stock turbo. I'm not sure how i'm missing it ?

Matt M

You are missing what my argument was to begin with. I will break it down for you:

Someone stated that the 2871 is good for 75whp more than the K04. I said that is not a valid claim because no one has approached those numbers yet.

BYT said that we made the same kind of claim because we said our head/cam/tune package can add up to 100hp. His reasoning is because we only made about 400 when others have made 360 without the head and cams. However- they obviously have a tune, so his arument is pointless to me.

Do you understand my point now?

HHRSSouth

Funny how I never needed a dyno to predict 370-390 whp, when the BNR 2871 first came out before anyone dyno'd. I also stuck to my guns with that figure throughout this whole "we need dyno numbers" ordeal.

Thats what happens when you research a BNR GT2871 turbo your looking at on other vehicles and the same displacement size engine by various manufacturers.

I'm talking hrs of research over various forums and threads that I coudl find.

I even told you once Cubaniche that you should get the 2871 over the 2860 after researching the pro's / con's of both (remember I was originally getting the 2860).

To be honest people pissed me off and I stopped caring whether or not anyone (but my Alabama boys) got real info on it, since everyone "knew (or thought they knew)" what they were talking about as far as the BNR GT2871 went (except for a few in pm's).

The people I felt needed to know stuff I responded to, plain and simple.

donkeyballs

iTrader: (3)

So i can put your heads, cam, and tune on my stock car and it will net 100whp?

elecblue06

iTrader: (1)

blink blink.. so would you say your head/ cams should be be able to provide a 25 whp gain or not? this is all i'm asking.. i'm not saying anything about advertised gains of the turbo.. just your head.. yes or no.. just answer it bluntly you guys have never answered what your head/cams will do on a car will full bolt ons have you ? thats all i'm saying .. if it makes X whp on a stock turbo car.. with a bigger turbo.. it should make at least X whp thats it .. you're not really making a point here.. that i'm seeing at least.. I know you guys know your **** but all the 75 whp guestimation was for the fact it's put down 50-60 more down then the stock k04 currently.. and they think theres room left for more..

09CobaltSS1

I like werewolf movies and my mom thinks I'm cute..

Just throwin it out there

So hey, that bnr 2871.. one hell of a little turbo ey?

HHRSSouth

I find it funny some people want to compare a E85 K04 to a E47 blend or 93 Octane BNR 2871 turbo.

So what happens when a HPFP becomes available so you can run straight E85 on the BNR 2871?

E85 BNR 2871 > E85 K04 by huge numbers.

cubaniche

iTrader: (1)

LOL Dude, I agree with you. I wasnt trying to compare numbers E vs 93. I was simply stating a fact about what to expect on E and what to expect on 93. And I regret not taking your advice about going with the 2871 from the beginning, problem is that I had already purchased the 2860. When you told me that you didnt really make what you were expecting on the 2871 I automatically assumed you meant it was way lower than expected. Granted you had just started tuning and you dont have lots of mods, not even an intake. I shouldnt have assumed that it was going to be terrible like the 2860 LOL I was obviously wrong about that as its putting down some great numbers.

Lets not all start turning on eachother here. Everyone whos opinion counts all agree that the 2871 is a GREAT bolt on upgrade to the stocker

HHRSSouth

That wasn't specifically to you man

I didn't quote you or put your name in there, that was a general post, all is good

I didn't want to use that dyno for results, I found out later (after I dyno'd) the shop owner had been vacuuming out the dyno well/pit after rain here because he had a roof leak and water was sitting in there. (I did not know this or would not have dyno'd at all)

No way in hell I'm trusting dyno results from a shop that has to vacuum water out of there dyno right before I get on it.

Thus why I said I in a pm why I was waiting till a re-dyno to post numbers.

I'm not posting up results from something that could skew numbers like that, that would be irresponsible on my part.

cubaniche

iTrader: (1)

True. That response was more about your earlier post about researching the differences between the two.

Anyways, weve heard alot from drewbroo but what about you man. Hows she running? Did you finalize tuning with Vince? More importantly is your wife happy now that it doesnt have that little flutter while at cruise?

drewbroo

iTrader: (2)

Matt.... and all the haters look. 393WHP - 75WHP = 318WHP

PBASS's car: Stock KO4 Injen CAI, Injen hotside, Dejon coldside, Treadstone TR8 IC, Catless DP, GMS1, tune 311.4WHP on 93OCT

My car: K&N SRI, CIA CP's, ZZP IC, Synapse Catless DP, GMS1 sensors, 3'' Catback, BNR2871 E47 blend 18 degrees max timing 393WHP


393WHP-311WHP=82WHP gain over a car with basically the same supporting mods. I don't know what else you need other than me taking the turbo off the car and re-dynoing it with the stock turbo on the same dyno.

cubaniche

iTrader: (1)

Nice comparo Drew

Not sure what else ppl are looking for. Its staring them in the face right there

EXCESSboost

I know why they are down talking the product. These 2 vendors that are heavily envolved with this thread both have K04 turbocharger products. One a reworked K04 and the other in the design stage. If they both give in and give positive remarks, that means their turbo market will drop. Ofcourse they don't want that.

I don't get envolved when discussing other business's products. Everyone has to make money to pay bills and feed their families and I respect that.

drewbroo

iTrader: (2)

well its not a ZZP Car so its always going to be sub par. I wonder why we have not seen ANYONE put down the numbers that ZZP claims for their stock K04 cars. (on a mustang dyno) Magic seems to just happen in their shop. Also NO ONE (other than ZZP of course) has been able to run 370+WHP of E70/E85. (mustang dyno) (without spray) Also its weird how your fuel systems don't max out where everyone elses do.

HHRSSouth

Car has ran strong since I got the first tune done on the BNR 2871 (after Drew helped me figure the Tial Q BOV out).

We are done fine tuning the MAF relocate (tweaks are taking longer these days to get).

I'm just waiting to get 1st gear turned down again to 7psi and 2nd gear set back to the way I liked it pre MAF relocate, which was boost to 20 psi and then build the rest of the boost to 26 psi.
Works awesome for traction on my car.

The car runs much smoother now between shifts and with the cruise control on over inclines and declines.

But with that said, u do not need a MAF relocate, I drove without one for a month with no issue other then the slight stutter when the BOV vented.
It wasn't a major issue other then long cruises with cruise control on.

EXCESSboost

Its called a wet kit lol

cubaniche

iTrader: (1)

Awesome man! Good to hear it. Ive always wondered what ppls faces look like after getting spanked by a four door HHR lol Must be a priceless moment

@Drew Its cool man. Were not modding our cars to prove anything to shops like ZZP. We do it cause we love it and in actuality, were following ZZPs moto 'go fast. not broke'

HHRSSouth

I spanked a turbo civic hatch and some kind of modded prelude Easter day.

The Prelude on the way to Easter dinner (wasn;t even a contest), very tastefully modded imo (blk, lowered, nice sounding exhaust, not ricey).

The Turbo Honda Hatchback (saw the FMIC in my rearview as he caught up) on the way home (Drk. green metallic with Bronze wheels), he caught up to me on purpose and vented his BOV next to me.

I let him get the jump (I was in 3rd gear) and still put multiple lengths on him.

Aftwerwards him and his passenger pull up next to me (passenger was laughing at the driver) and gave me thumbs up.

cubaniche

iTrader: (1)

Haha! lol Thats badass man!

I cant wait to have this turbo on the car already. Ive got the CP modded and flange welded on already. All Im missing is to mod the intake for the recirc.

HHRSSouth

I have my clutch installed and broke in also since the dyno and

I had a CAI, then made it a custom CAI, it was a 3" CAI that went behind the headlight in the HHR SS, but after driving with it for 3 days, I found that after driving around, parking and then touching the intake tube, it felt as hot as the UICP

So I cut the intake off, basically in half and ran 3" tubing through the fender well hole down behind my foglight (where the factory BOX gets air) and put my K&N on and mounted it.
I basically have a version of a short ram intake with a true 3" pipe/bend to the turbo inlet (about 2' of pipe) and then made it into a CAI from the end down thru the fender hole and into the fender well.
I went for a ride, very aggressive driving came home, popped the hood and touched the new version CAI, the thing was cold! not warm, luke warm, but cold and the UICP was hot as usual.

How is that for real world results of which CAI setup runs colder? Both runs were in the middle of the day and 80 degree weather.

Keep in mind without the MAF relocate, this set up would probably not work, possibly due to bad MAF skewing.

drewbroo

iTrader: (2)

It doesn't really matter too much on how cold the air is when its about to be processed though a 10,000 degree oven (the turbo). Now the piping after the turbo is where it counts. On colder days its the colder temps running through your intercooler that makes the car faster.

cubaniche

iTrader: (1)

Sweet. So now you have a custom CAI. The MAF not being in the intake anymore is nice for you cause it leaves you open to mod your intake as you see fit now. I understand that the HHR doesnt have many intake options so its cool how you resolved that issue. Also, the fact that theres a descernable difference in temp ought to account for something

HHRSSouth

I've already read all the data for CAI on turbo cars and that they don't need a CAI due to the turbo warming up the air, etc.

But I will stick with a intake that is cold after hard pulls vs. a hot one any day.

I did notice better idle quality and smoother running engine also just by switching set ups.

I did find a back to back dyno test of a SRI vs. CAI on a mazda speed, the CAI made more whp, while the SRI made more wtq.

SRI vs CAI on the DYNO!!

But you know how dynos are so anything could have changed between pulls, this is probably as about close to accurate your going to get on a dyno witha comparison imo.

drewbroo

iTrader: (2)

Also with the CAI there could have been less disturbance in air flow. With a turbo car what you want is air flowing at its most efficient. Colder air does flow more efficiently if that helps. Also shorting or lengthening the intake track will change the way the air flows. The 4 door is getting a BYT SRI, Nick has designed it to where the air has the least amount of resistance flowing through it.

HHRSSouth

Something helped the idle and smoothing out of the engine, all I did was what I said previously. I can only attribute it to the change in the intake I made, since I have no MAF in the intake tube, all other connections and tune are the same.

Yeah I'm not sold on a SRI, I know the theories behind it but I'll take cooler air/whp over hotter air/torque, personal preference.

Anyhow any pipe with a 3" bend in the intake before the turbo on a HHR SS is a HUGE improvement over stock.