ZZP girdled block
#52
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Thank you. I'm sure ZZP will do a great job. I will get all the parts entirely from them (other than the axles) and I will ship them the car to install everything. I'm sure their labor will be outstanding and that they will tune it at its best
#53
Former Vendor
Hi Matt,
thank you for your reply. Yes looking around I've already decided to drop the sleeves. So, they are no longer my concern.
Did you look at my post above regarding my build? Can you give me your opinion about it? I'm not ordering the parts and have a local tuner do it, I will ship the car to you
BTW, I've got 2 calls from you guys today but I couldn't pick up at work. I hope someone will call me again tomorrow
Thank you.
Christian
thank you for your reply. Yes looking around I've already decided to drop the sleeves. So, they are no longer my concern.
Did you look at my post above regarding my build? Can you give me your opinion about it? I'm not ordering the parts and have a local tuner do it, I will ship the car to you
BTW, I've got 2 calls from you guys today but I couldn't pick up at work. I hope someone will call me again tomorrow
Thank you.
Christian
#54
I would save your money and run the ZZP rods. We have tested them to more than enough whp. We wouldn't run them in our race engines or sell them to our customers if they were not up to the task at hand. We do a good amount of testing on our engine products before we release them to the public. You can sleep soundly knowing that our rods are in your engine. For example, we tested my car to 898whp and 54psi, no rod falure. I had a vac line come off at CED and the boost was well over 50psi and an afr that wasn't even close to safe. The block broke, the piston was in the bore sideways, the head was ruined, but the rod never broke. Go Fast Not Broke, buy ZZP
#55
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I would save your money and run the ZZP rods. We have tested them to more than enough whp. We wouldn't run them in our race engines or sell them to our customers if they were not up to the task at hand. We do a good amount of testing on our engine products before we release them to the public. You can sleep soundly knowing that our rods are in your engine. For example, we tested my car to 898whp and 54psi, no rod falure. I had a vac line come off at CED and the boost was well over 50psi and an afr that wasn't even close to safe. The block broke, the piston was in the bore sideways, the head was ruined, but the rod never broke. Go Fast Not Broke, buy ZZP
#56
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I would save your money and run the ZZP rods. We have tested them to more than enough whp. We wouldn't run them in our race engines or sell them to our customers if they were not up to the task at hand. We do a good amount of testing on our engine products before we release them to the public. You can sleep soundly knowing that our rods are in your engine. For example, we tested my car to 898whp and 54psi, no rod falure. I had a vac line come off at CED and the boost was well over 50psi and an afr that wasn't even close to safe. The block broke, the piston was in the bore sideways, the head was ruined, but the rod never broke. Go Fast Not Broke, buy ZZP
Will the Supertech .5mm oversized inconel valves work correctly with your head/cam combo?
#57
Former Vendor
Didn't decide yet. There is an E85 gas station by me, which I will probably use. Can we do a dual tune in case I decide to use 93 fuel pump for a period, expecially in the winter? As far as fuel mods, what do you need? Meth kit? Bigger injectors? I've also seen somebody saying that they have a 5th injector. Which one of the above would apply to me?
#58
Former Vendor
They could be installed, but that doesn't necessarily mean more power. DI motors require more attention to detail in the intake ports and combustion chamber design to function properly.
#59
Former Vendor
Where is the limit on the in tank pump hp wise Matt? And what hp can just the cam with fuel pump Lobe run for most that do not want to upgrade the in tank pump or run a 5th injector just zzp efr bolt on turbo on pump or E? That is where it seems confusing and where do you recommend the forged pistons then what hp level for those that do not want the expense of buying rods also? a list of where you recommend each upgrade would be great conservatively of course not written in stone to be safe that is not needed.
It's tough to put a recommendation on when to run forged pistons. The stock pistons will hold up fine at 600whp if you run good fuel and a reasonable tune. The further you stray from these conditions, the sooner you will need forged pistons.
#61
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It will be easier to hit your power goals on Ethanol. Our 5th injector kit and fuel pump lobe along with an Aeromotive in-tank pump will support 600whp. You can run a larger 5th injector to push 650. Adding a boost reference on the in-tank pump could possibly get you to 700whp. Unless your car is less than 2500lbs race ready, that much power will destroy transmissions left and right. Plus, a 700whp 2.1 liter setup will not spool at <3500rpm like you are looking for. You'd be looking at a 62mm turbo minimum.
Well, they don't cost much compared to the whole cost of the build, so minus as well doing it, since the block will be opened
#62
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With our pump lobe and injection timing alterations, you can get to 525whp on gas, maybe a little more. Of course it depends on the RPM of the motor considering that the output from the hpfp increases with engine speed. Switching to E85, you are looking at more in the range of 475whp max. You can add our 5th injector to get a little further, but the in-tank pump won't get too much further. I would upgrade the in-tank pump on anything over 500whp on e85.
It's tough to put a recommendation on when to run forged pistons. The stock pistons will hold up fine at 600whp if you run good fuel and a reasonable tune. The further you stray from these conditions, the sooner you will need forged pistons.
It's tough to put a recommendation on when to run forged pistons. The stock pistons will hold up fine at 600whp if you run good fuel and a reasonable tune. The further you stray from these conditions, the sooner you will need forged pistons.
#63
Yes sorry Ayrton, He was answering some of my questions that is that with E needing more fuel the cutoff would be 475 to 500 Hp w/o needing an in tank pump upgrade, He was not saying that Gas makes more Hp than E! Where with gas the max would be about 525 or so max. W/O needing the in tank pump. The E will make a lot more than 525hp to a point then would require a 5th injector to go even further on the E for even higher Hp numbers all 3 fueling upgrades are required. In tank pump upgrade,Cams with lobe upgrade and a 5th injector.
Thanks for the info Matt M. that helped a lot and also the piston info.
Thanks for the info Matt M. that helped a lot and also the piston info.
Last edited by jarhead; 12-02-2011 at 06:11 AM.
#64
Former Vendor
Well, they don't cost much compared to the whole cost of the build, so minus as well doing it, since the block will be opened
#65
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#66
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Fully built bottom end and top end with electric water pump and neutral balance shafts. What can the LNF rev out to safely? I personally was thinking ~9000rpm but then theres the issue of maybe the hpfp floating and being smacked around. Have you found ways around that issue such as a stronger return spring or upgraded hpfp? yet?
#67
Former Vendor
Fully built bottom end and top end with electric water pump and neutral balance shafts. What can the LNF rev out to safely? I personally was thinking ~9000rpm but then theres the issue of maybe the hpfp floating and being smacked around. Have you found ways around that issue such as a stronger return spring or upgraded hpfp? yet?
#69
Senior Member
Wise decision. Good luck with your build. I am sure it will be one special lnf once she's done.
#70
Senior Member
With our pump lobe and injection timing alterations, you can get to 525whp on gas, maybe a little more. Of course it depends on the RPM of the motor considering that the output from the hpfp increases with engine speed. Switching to E85, you are looking at more in the range of 475whp max. You can add our 5th injector to get a little further, but the in-tank pump won't get too much further. I would upgrade the in-tank pump on anything over 500whp on e85.
It's tough to put a recommendation on when to run forged pistons. The stock pistons will hold up fine at 600whp if you run good fuel and a reasonable tune. The further you stray from these conditions, the sooner you will need forged pistons.
It's tough to put a recommendation on when to run forged pistons. The stock pistons will hold up fine at 600whp if you run good fuel and a reasonable tune. The further you stray from these conditions, the sooner you will need forged pistons.
#71
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#72
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500 on pump gas is tough. You would need an open exhaust for maximum efficiency. Both your cat and recirc watsegate would be serious restrictions at that power level. Ported head would help, and forged pistons would add a safety margin, but a 500whp pump gas lnf would be pushed pretty hard to get there.
#74
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We've spent and easy 200k getting to where we are now with just the LNF. You can do that 200k of work for less than 10k now because we know what to do. To 'try something else' be prepared to spend insane amounts of $ if you really want to blaze a new trail.