Help, I'm debating 2.0 SS/SC engine vs vtec honda
05-22-2008, 03:20 PM
#101
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listen moron. you can't build a motor, and fuel system to support 1600hp with the engine management for 8 including the turbo kit.
so go sit in the back of the short bus and keep licking the window.
05-22-2008, 03:21 PM
#102
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Welcome to the world of mustang aftermarket.
05-22-2008, 03:24 PM
#103
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05-22-2008, 03:28 PM
#105
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if you had the slightest idea on what vtec is, how it works, what it takes to make it work, ect you would understand just how important it is, and can be to ANY engine.
05-22-2008, 03:29 PM
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I originally got it from a funny picture that shows a v-tec and the air flow going into the engine, and the caption was what I said before: " V-tec: all of the lag, and none of the boost"
Or how bout this one:
V-tec: " Its like waiting for really bad sex."
05-22-2008, 03:30 PM
#107
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the **** you cant.. you can do it cheaper in a mustang.. learn something besides small displacement ohc motors and you might learn something oh great one.. for one that knows alot.. you make some ignorant ass comments.
05-22-2008, 03:33 PM
#109
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It's not that either engine is a bad engine. Most people just have a hard time w/ perspective. Everything is relavent and nothing makes or breaks this arguement.
They're both phenominal engines, but for very different reasons. We shouldn't be comparing a low-level performance built NA engine vs. a low-level performance built F/I engine to begin w/. Then you end up w/ the retarded arguements like we have going on.
...slap a turbo on this, port that. If you throw F/I on a K20, you have a motor w/ a performance built head sporting phenominal flow characteristics that support those modifications to the max. You want to use that scenario, then take the F/I ecotec and build the head for those superior flow characteristics. You've got yourself a good freakin' match, provided you use a more efficient compressor on the LSJ. Obviously, everyone is bound by capital, some more than others. In the end, with enough money, either engine can be a freakin' monster, it's just easier for the K20 guys...
They're both phenominal engines, but for very different reasons. We shouldn't be comparing a low-level performance built NA engine vs. a low-level performance built F/I engine to begin w/. Then you end up w/ the retarded arguements like we have going on.
...slap a turbo on this, port that. If you throw F/I on a K20, you have a motor w/ a performance built head sporting phenominal flow characteristics that support those modifications to the max. You want to use that scenario, then take the F/I ecotec and build the head for those superior flow characteristics. You've got yourself a good freakin' match, provided you use a more efficient compressor on the LSJ. Obviously, everyone is bound by capital, some more than others. In the end, with enough money, either engine can be a freakin' monster, it's just easier for the K20 guys...
Last edited by Edubs; 05-22-2008 at 04:02 PM.
05-22-2008, 03:34 PM
#111
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welcome to reality.
i'll be your ******* guide.
what happens to a 1600 hp car on the street. it gets hosed by a 600 hp car from a dig. why? because the owner is a moron and completely forgot about suspension and tires. this same sap just blew apart his motor because he was told that his precious stock motor would hold it.
granted 03-04 motors are stout and can handle some serious power. they will not live day to day with 1600 to the crank.
this same special kid also forgot that his stock tranny, clutch, axles, driveshaft, rear end, would hold it.
do you even have a remote clue what it takes to hold 1600 hp to the ground?
i'll be your ******* guide.
what happens to a 1600 hp car on the street. it gets hosed by a 600 hp car from a dig. why? because the owner is a moron and completely forgot about suspension and tires. this same sap just blew apart his motor because he was told that his precious stock motor would hold it.
granted 03-04 motors are stout and can handle some serious power. they will not live day to day with 1600 to the crank.
this same special kid also forgot that his stock tranny, clutch, axles, driveshaft, rear end, would hold it.
do you even have a remote clue what it takes to hold 1600 hp to the ground?
05-22-2008, 03:35 PM
#113
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some of you need to realize.. GM isnt dumping as much money in ecotec as you think.. and to have this motor already > then all the honda motors says something.. GM R&D is not in the 4-banger world so its sad honda is already getting its records owned...
GM can build a 850 hp NA V8 smallblack and turns 9000rpm constantly for hours on end... im not to worried how they will handle the 4-banger when they choose to actually but in quality time and effort and not just "tinkering"
GM can build a 850 hp NA V8 smallblack and turns 9000rpm constantly for hours on end... im not to worried how they will handle the 4-banger when they choose to actually but in quality time and effort and not just "tinkering"
the ecotec's development pre-production was the 6th largest budget ever spent on a commercial engine.
and that was with sharing and support from people like sabb and lotus (before GM had any stock interest with sabb)
and that was only PRE-PRODUCTION!
the race development dam near trumps thats!
that "850 hp NA V8 small block and turns 9000rpm constantly for hours on end" takes more money to get rite then you could imagine,not so much design overhall, but the small changes that have to be done over and over again to get such a motor to exist with its self for a prolonged amount of time are massively time consuming. thus taking a large budget with it.
if you'd like to talk to one of the cal engineers, or machinists that made said engine exist, along with C6R power plant and theZR1 engine, let me know. i work with them on a personal level and would be more then happy to fill you in on just how much work goes into an engine of such capabilities.
take what ever thoughts you have of cheep ecotec development and toss them out the window, with you attached.
05-22-2008, 03:36 PM
#115
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welcome to reality.
i'll be your ******* guide.
what happens to a 1600 hp car on the street. it gets hosed by a 600 hp car from a dig. why? because the owner is a moron and completely forgot about suspension and tires. this same sap just blew apart his motor because he was told that his precious stock motor would hold it.
granted 03-04 motors are stout and can handle some serious power. they will not live day to day with 1600 to the crank.
this same special kid also forgot that his stock tranny, clutch, axles, driveshaft, rear end, would hold it.
do you even have a remote clue what it takes to hold 1600 hp to the ground?
i'll be your ******* guide.
what happens to a 1600 hp car on the street. it gets hosed by a 600 hp car from a dig. why? because the owner is a moron and completely forgot about suspension and tires. this same sap just blew apart his motor because he was told that his precious stock motor would hold it.
granted 03-04 motors are stout and can handle some serious power. they will not live day to day with 1600 to the crank.
this same special kid also forgot that his stock tranny, clutch, axles, driveshaft, rear end, would hold it.
do you even have a remote clue what it takes to hold 1600 hp to the ground?
05-22-2008, 03:36 PM
#116
Senior Member
the stangs live the life of awesome after market.
the GTO's have it pretty go thus far as well.
05-22-2008, 03:38 PM
#118
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zankies
i have more fun in that car than i do in my ss
brad. how about this one.
stock 1990 5.0 mustang.
factory original.
how would YOU go about getting 1600 hp out of it, AND being able to use it for 8k
i have more fun in that car than i do in my ss
brad. how about this one.
stock 1990 5.0 mustang.
factory original.
how would YOU go about getting 1600 hp out of it, AND being able to use it for 8k
Last edited by Area47; 05-22-2008 at 03:38 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
05-22-2008, 03:38 PM
#119
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im not 100% but i dont think you dont need to rebuild it until your over at or above 11psi; they make about 285Hp at9psi. the jackson racing supercharger kit(uses the m62) runs 5psi stock and cost 3k. add the cost of a 3.2 pulley, belt and 650cc injectors and you have 9 psi
05-22-2008, 03:42 PM
#122
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That quote is not coming from me. Its something Ive heard from many people. Kind of like the SRT-4 "is just a neon".
I originally got it from a funny picture that shows a v-tec and the air flow going into the engine, and the caption was what I said before: " V-tec: all of the lag, and none of the boost"
Or how bout this one:
V-tec: " Its like waiting for really bad sex."
I originally got it from a funny picture that shows a v-tec and the air flow going into the engine, and the caption was what I said before: " V-tec: all of the lag, and none of the boost"
Or how bout this one:
V-tec: " Its like waiting for really bad sex."
just to toss things into perspective.
if your snazzy little muftang had vtec, I-vvt, VVT, ect....any one of the adjustable cam set ups (just cam phase, no lifter or duratio adjustment) you'd be making a solid chunk more power then you are rite now.
you almost seem as hard headed as the GTO owners at work....there dense as can be.
one thing i will comment on.
regardless of my position here, i'm not slamming the eco, its a great little motor.
tough as nails, and came from the factory with some nice beef parts.
however, we as owners, cant shut our eyes and pretended that its the greatest thing since sliced cheese here.l
Last edited by 06black; 05-22-2008 at 03:42 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
05-22-2008, 03:44 PM
#124
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this thread is funny but anyways there both great engines and with a k20 the norm is around 9psi with a blower and ive seen up to 15psi with a snail and these are on stock k20's
05-22-2008, 03:44 PM
#125
Senior Member
im not 100% but i dont think you dont need to rebuild it until your over at or above 11psi; they make about 285Hp at9psi. the jackson racing supercharger kit(uses the m62) runs 5psi stock and cost 3k. add the cost of a 3.2 pulley, belt and 650cc injectors and you have 9 psi
k20 at 8-9psi on a GT35R with a T3 hot side made 380 on a local mustang dyno.
made constant power till redline.
fun little car.
stock engine.