Asphalt Assault

I think tune time got a new dyno though if I read correctly. you may have been on the old dyno b4 the mustang came into play. not only that but what gear did you pull? weather will impact or even condition of the dyno. results is best when one car is run right after the other.

PuSha050

happy matt came in here and cleaned it up... i love my Tune time tune -- definately rips and zero problems.. have a couple more things comin prob around xmas and def gonna head down there and get it updated on the dyno.. WOOOOO

rickay726

mustand dynos are called heartbreaker dynos cause the number read so low.

SSdan

I still think its weird that I dynod nearly 10whp more untuned on a bigger. So did chevysalesman

chevysalesman614

i agree, and i kept asking matt why.. but he wouldnt really answer. the cars gotta be a dud.

nope. its the same dyno. at the top of my sheet it says mustang dynometer or whatever.. not dynojet research. plus ive seen recent vids taken at the shop, and its definitly the dyno i was on. DTM is the only one i know of that was on a dynojet over there.
i guess weather.. it was hotter outside when i was there too. perhaps he dyno'd on a rainy day (100% humidity)? i cant figure it out man.

an0malous

can we see a log of a 2.7 with 42s?
im not closeminded enough that i cant be proven wrong.
but so far ive seen no proof...

PuSha050

well i kno the weahter will make a huge difference.. i dynoed stock and put down 223/190 but in 25 degree weather.. then with 3" 42# and matts custom tune i put down 226/200 in (If i had to guess-cuz i dont exactly remember) about 65 degree weather.. but i kno for damn sure im a hell of a lot faster now than i was stock... esp when i kno on matts dyno stock is around 190/185

cant give u proof but i love that attitudelol

06black

I'm with this guy^^^^

I've tuned MULTIPLE cars with 42's and even more with 60's. I've got dam near perfect drive-ability out of the 60's with little to no idle bounce and awesome behavior else ware.

the bottom line is this, EVERY car i've loged be it one of my tunes, intense, GM, ect the IDC's are well and above the safe range when you push past the 2.9 range.

i'll run a 2.9 car with 60's all day every day because i kno i have plenty of cushion to play with.....

pre-turbo when i was a 2.5car with every bolt on plus a messaged head the idcs at 7300-7400 were into the 60-70% range, thus why i love this injector!

not saying i cant or wont be proven wrong but i will say that i don't make many mistakes and its been a long time since i have been proven wrong.

Rangerondubz

X2...

cavy-to-SS

hey rickay726 what color is your car...i work in freehold mall...drive a yellow ss/sc

Asphalt Assault

[QUOTE=an0malous;1681447]can we see a log of a 2.7 with 42s?
im not closeminded enough that i cant be proven wrong.
but so far ive seen no proof...[/QUOTE]

Man I know it is words but you say you never make mistakes!? get of your soap box! long time since proven wrong confirms it, you have made mistakes or errors or ommissions. just that statement alone was a mistake and you have be proven wrong with your own statements. LOL (just pushing you back into your corner, BOXER).

on a serious note now there is no doubt in my mind the data you guys see through HPT is what you see. I have HPT Pro and see the similar thing. I am at 84% to 92% at redline. I am not sure the data that HPT's is correct since were at the max and then GM provides a 3.0 pulley in stage 3 and then will allow for a 50 dry shot and say the 42's are good for all that. I mean really what tuner would go ahead and say this is safe when you look at those #'s. They have to be seeing different data using other logs with other tuning software. cause of the difference in software, unless it is a screen shot, no proof can be provided as we dont have their PCM Suite to look at it obviously.

bottom line if this tuner was bad cars would be blowing up. and since he does so many cars there must be a difference in data being provided between the PCM suites then. WHat does he use any way. if it is HPT then I will STFU.

06black

[QUOTE=ssnipes;1682404]never said i DONT make mistakes, its just vary uncommon thats all.

GM can release what ever they want with stage kits, its not a implicit warranty on them so they can cut and weave around issues if need be.

the formula for IDC is a given and is a constant, its variales have to be accurit or else we have a whole other set of fuel system issuse to worry about.

HPT is correct, that much i do know. as for cars blowing up if his tunes push injectors to hard, thats true but we dont know how long it'll be before some thing does and will happen.

none the less,to each there own but i say its the wrong thing to do.

Asphalt Assault

[QUOTE=06black;1682465]Well I for one think GM knows what they are doing. they are a manufacturer of course. As for your statement that you say it is uncommon is quite different from what you originally stated but that is email and words right. our interpretation can be different. as far as the IDC calculation - it is a calculation. and our end goal for tuning is 14.7. the other numbers can be different and make a tune work even with in HPT. you take any tune and you will find different tables and they still produce 14.7 AFR cruising. it is just 3's. and that goes with the IDC. it is the only thing that makes sense is that the IDC readings are different from one program to the next. and it is quite possible to have proper #'s else where and have a good tune. THE IDC's are an indicator and is not used in producing needed injector pulses to achieve the commanded AFR. So I would disagree that the IDC's can be off and still have an appropriate tune. it is calculated so it is not a constant and the variables dont have to be accurate cause these #'s dont even come into account when used for injector pulse. There is no such thing as 117% injector pulse for example. that is a calculated value the injector actual will be 100% and nothing more for example.

ludicristSS

We have used a TECH 2 to confirm as well as simple math . I have pushed 42's far on LS1's with boost before and it never made sense to me why the factual hard numbers of 42=336 crank would change by so much .

Also FYI this community has been stirred up with more boost is better but it's not I would rather us a 2.9 and run it leaner with less timing to keep the blower in it's eff range and make equal to or more power then a smaller pulley given 2 back to back dyno pulls . Any one look how lean commaned a/f and how much timing is in the earlier stage 2 file ? wonder why ?

Area47

artificial effiency is fun though!

whats sad is, my iat2 temps with the 2.7 now are lower than when it was just stage 2. just has a lot of help to do so. which might also explain why my egt's on a 0-110 mph run are 1350 degree's.

well within thermal limits of the engine.
at some point the injectors will die out. this is a given, they all have a shelf life.

::shrugs::

you guys can battle this out all you want

Asphalt Assault

how so? that does not make sense or did leave out some mntioning of cooloing mods as well?

06black

(dident mean to quote area 47 for the post, just for my first line. the rest is directed toward ssnipes)

book efficiency's!!!

yea that guy above is rite, a specific PW=a specific AFR. but if you put that PW into an IDC calculation then you have IDC.

that formula doesn't not change thus giving you a mathematical calculation that can be used on any car with any injector.

if i log PW on my tech2, then again on auto tap, and again on HPT you will get the same PW, thus giving the same IDC across the board regardless of software because that mathematical calculation doesn't change. you only need to input the required variables

none the less you can think what you want, thats up to you. however you should know this, if you push an injector close to and including 100% duty cycle it will fail in time.

but yea, i'm still no advocate of anything lower then a 2.9 on the 42's.

i dont have any issue tuning 60's and i love how nice and easy any set up is on a set of them.

Area47

if you pay attention to most of my posts there is some mention of what i have done.

how else could i get away with 12.3 afr and 24 degree's of timing on a 2.7?


water injection and cobra h/e

thats it.


06, it's cool man

chevysalesman614

i thought everyone on the site knew area had water injection

Asphalt Assault

You say it all directed to me except the first line. hmmm

I didnt talk about 2.9 and 42's. I am not advocating this is safe. I do not have an opinion about these #'s. but I can tell you this. with HPT your theory is correct it is a calculation but I found that even though my AFR guage was setup I had to be watching cause it would read differently.

I have not ran one of your tunes but there has not be a great tune that drove perfectly that like a factory GM for drivability that I have found ever. I did my own and I tried lots of others with different theories in tuning as well. not saying your tune isnt great at all. I just have not seen one that runs up to my standard. even my own tune does not run to my standard. I also have left that up to my injectors as well. they seemed to be funky and inputs given made them run very differently. especially idle. Dont take this as I am a great tuner or something. I will even say it "your a better tuner than me". My pride is not that big to just say it.

As far as PW's yeah that seems simple enough but it still does not make sense that GM will set up 42's with a 50 dry shot and consider it dafe or how these other tuners find it safe. I have toyed with the idea of trying other PCM software to see differences but a cheaper way is for my car to go to a local tuner. that way I dont have to buy it just to see. but if I am getting the LNF then why bother. enough said...LOL

I also understand how injectors fail by the way thanks.

Well I dont keep a running tap on what everyone is running. it changes quite quickly.

Area47

whats more fun is the fact that gm locked the ms/idc/iat2, and something else out of the stage 3 ecm so it can not be logged, so the true answer lies with the tec2 if someone can get ahold of it and use it on a stage 3 car. then the answer would come out.

06black

not directed toward you as an attack just reference you so Area47 wouldn't get confused.

all my other logging software says the same as HPT in regard to IDC that much i'm sure of.

the only logic i see in the reason why GM push's the 42's so hard is because on the cost / benefit analysis says that the majorities of the maxed out injectors will last past warranty...thats my best guess

as for an example of my tuning, check my turbo dyno thread...she makes some good power.

JMHZ2401

I do not think that will answer anything major important to this post. It will allow people to figure out how GM tuned that ECU.

Area47

actually it will give the answer that everyone is looking for.

blackss2.0

whats a ball park price for a tune by matt.