zzp long tube Question
12-23-2013, 07:47 PM
#27
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Well either way your goal should be to identify the big balence we all face.
Cost vs Planned use, which goes against the budget. I went with a 3in system just to remove a restriction from the car to the end of the line upgrades, and most the racer's I know will tell you somewhere between 3 and 4.5in pipe is a good race setup for less restrictive category racers.
Honestly though, I say if you can afford it do you want it? Sometimes the right stuff is like that thing you want, other times you find the lesser option is more ideal. Full system work is a great start, and if your goals are not above 400hp 2.5 is fine.
That's a wicked sick look at how heat affects the metal though Tjolley, not seen something like that since worked on Cobra's. Good stuff ZZP, good stuff...
Cost vs Planned use, which goes against the budget. I went with a 3in system just to remove a restriction from the car to the end of the line upgrades, and most the racer's I know will tell you somewhere between 3 and 4.5in pipe is a good race setup for less restrictive category racers.
Honestly though, I say if you can afford it do you want it? Sometimes the right stuff is like that thing you want, other times you find the lesser option is more ideal. Full system work is a great start, and if your goals are not above 400hp 2.5 is fine.
That's a wicked sick look at how heat affects the metal though Tjolley, not seen something like that since worked on Cobra's. Good stuff ZZP, good stuff...
12-23-2013, 08:25 PM
#28
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So I got the extra O2 bung in the longtube, will it make a difference if I put the cars upstream O2 sensor in the second upstream O2 bung instead of the first?
12-23-2013, 08:44 PM
#29
how many bungs do you have? 2 total, or 3?
put the primary o2 sensor in the first bung no questions asked.
if you have three, then put your wideband next and the secondary o2 last.
if you only have 2 and have no wideband, put the secondary in the last bung. if you have a wideband, you can disconnect the secondary o2 and run your wideband into that bung if its a catless dp
put the primary o2 sensor in the first bung no questions asked.
if you have three, then put your wideband next and the secondary o2 last.
if you only have 2 and have no wideband, put the secondary in the last bung. if you have a wideband, you can disconnect the secondary o2 and run your wideband into that bung if its a catless dp
12-23-2013, 10:05 PM
#30
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I have three, and I was cold and didnt feel like re-running my aem wideband wire, so I just put it in the first bung and the cars wideband O2 sensor in the second one, they are both upstream of the cat, so will that affect the tune?
12-23-2013, 10:28 PM
#31
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I suspect to some degree it would, but the only job for the primary is to detect how much fuel is not burned, the secondary's only job is to make sure the ratio never exceeds emission standards/ second look at the ratio.
I'd hook it up like factory but I don't honestly believe it'd matter to much enless there is some portion of the pipe specificly located for it to get a read. I don't have picture so I don't know how it's doing it.
If you notice excessive fumes, smoke, or straight fuel smelling liquid out the tail pipe then perhaps it is taking a significant toll, otherwise don't see it being a problem.
I'd hook it up like factory but I don't honestly believe it'd matter to much enless there is some portion of the pipe specificly located for it to get a read. I don't have picture so I don't know how it's doing it.
If you notice excessive fumes, smoke, or straight fuel smelling liquid out the tail pipe then perhaps it is taking a significant toll, otherwise don't see it being a problem.
12-23-2013, 10:35 PM
#32
its gonna have a bit of a lag time and throw off trims a bit. how much, i dont know. may not even be a problem. i have my wideband back where the secondary o2 sensor is, and there is a good 1/8-1/4 second lag period between what my primary o2 is saying and the wideband is showing. but when you get a chance, put the primary o2 in the first bung. it measures knock as well. you want it as close as possible
also, i wouldnt leave your wideband unpowered and in a bung. it will wear out the sensor. they are supposed to heat up and if they arent powered, they will not heat properly and it will shorten the life of the sensor.
also, i wouldnt leave your wideband unpowered and in a bung. it will wear out the sensor. they are supposed to heat up and if they arent powered, they will not heat properly and it will shorten the life of the sensor.
12-23-2013, 11:48 PM
#33
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They are all plugged in and the car is stored for winter right now. But being a long tube set up I think there will already be a delay lol but ya when it warms up I will more then likely switch it, but its -9 actually temp right now, and it was 1 when I installed it lol.
12-24-2013, 12:04 AM
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Bro wait it out if you are going big, sounds better too. I was sort of Rally Accident into new exhaust so I was to mad to realize my credit card screaming for mercy when I went cat'ed 3in all the way ZZP w/LT.
12-24-2013, 12:38 PM
#36
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I hear ya man I am broke too right now, but I sold my gmpp manifold, and my 2.5 and 3 in zzp catted down pipes, bought long tubes on black friday at 40% off and made $20 lol
12-28-2014, 10:52 AM
#42
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Has anyone seen or have a dyno sheet that shows the difference between as shorty header and zzp long tubes? I hear there is a good difference but what to see it for my self. If so post it up here or a link, could not find any. Curious to see the torque difference, heard from two people that the torque becomes higher then hp
I went from 232 WHP to 240. The dyno sheets may be around here on the forums somewhere. Don't feel like looking for htem now, maybe I will later.
01-05-2015, 02:17 AM
#44
I'd have to dig really deep and may be able to find the dyno sheets. On my best friends M62 Cobalt we have a difference between a Cobalt Addiction shorty and a Pacesetter header.
2.65 pulley shorty-263 ish
2.65 pulley Pacesetter-275ish
That's roughly what my memory serves me at this point. He said he felt a better overall difference with the Pacesetter. Both on 3" catless dp and 91 dino fuel.
2.65 pulley shorty-263 ish
2.65 pulley Pacesetter-275ish
That's roughly what my memory serves me at this point. He said he felt a better overall difference with the Pacesetter. Both on 3" catless dp and 91 dino fuel.
01-11-2015, 11:06 PM
#45
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Lol well that would make sense because i have a cobalt addictive header on my wall and the ports and exit are smaller then stock lsj manifold ports and exit lol
on my 2.7, ported sc ported tb, zzp 3in intake, 80#'s, e85, gmpp maniold, 3in catted zzp dp, gmpp catback, on 25* max wot timing, 11.6 wot afr's, on a 106* iat1's and it was about 90% humidity i made 270whp and 250lbsft. On the same set up but add a 2.6, zzp catted long tubes, and 27* wot timing, 107* iat1's, 12.0 wot afr, and about 95% humidity i made 279whp and 250lbsft... so no more torque and a gain of 9 whp from a pulley drop, 2* more timing, and leaner afr's...
on my 2.7, ported sc ported tb, zzp 3in intake, 80#'s, e85, gmpp maniold, 3in catted zzp dp, gmpp catback, on 25* max wot timing, 11.6 wot afr's, on a 106* iat1's and it was about 90% humidity i made 270whp and 250lbsft. On the same set up but add a 2.6, zzp catted long tubes, and 27* wot timing, 107* iat1's, 12.0 wot afr, and about 95% humidity i made 279whp and 250lbsft... so no more torque and a gain of 9 whp from a pulley drop, 2* more timing, and leaner afr's...
Last edited by jamies06ss/sc; 01-11-2015 at 11:11 PM.
01-12-2015, 03:44 AM
#46
The header was larger then stock. 1.60 primary/3" exit. I remember he ordered a 3" exit because he wanted a big dp. His trq went up but I cant recall how much.
Basically all we remember was that yes there is a difference going to mid or long tube. His car got faster with the new header and picked up even more with a 3" catback. But it wasn't the size of the pipe that did it. Was the fact of a bigger muffler flowing more cfm.
Basically all we remember was that yes there is a difference going to mid or long tube. His car got faster with the new header and picked up even more with a 3" catback. But it wasn't the size of the pipe that did it. Was the fact of a bigger muffler flowing more cfm.
01-12-2015, 12:05 PM
#47
Lol well that would make sense because i have a cobalt addictive header on my wall and the ports and exit are smaller then stock lsj manifold ports and exit lol
on my 2.7, ported sc ported tb, zzp 3in intake, 80#'s, e85, gmpp maniold, 3in catted zzp dp, gmpp catback, on 25* max wot timing, 11.6 wot afr's, on a 106* iat1's and it was about 90% humidity i made 270whp and 250lbsft. On the same set up but add a 2.6, zzp catted long tubes, and 27* wot timing, 107* iat1's, 12.0 wot afr, and about 95% humidity i made 279whp and 250lbsft... so no more torque and a gain of 9 whp from a pulley drop, 2* more timing, and leaner afr's...
on my 2.7, ported sc ported tb, zzp 3in intake, 80#'s, e85, gmpp maniold, 3in catted zzp dp, gmpp catback, on 25* max wot timing, 11.6 wot afr's, on a 106* iat1's and it was about 90% humidity i made 270whp and 250lbsft. On the same set up but add a 2.6, zzp catted long tubes, and 27* wot timing, 107* iat1's, 12.0 wot afr, and about 95% humidity i made 279whp and 250lbsft... so no more torque and a gain of 9 whp from a pulley drop, 2* more timing, and leaner afr's...
