Brucesblack

o I know thats why im gonna build it all motor at first and then IF tuning come's out then i will go with FI .. but until then im saving money and buying part's as i can and when i get a chance i will tear her down and start the build ..

Shortbus

Do you have a dyno sheet of this or any proof of you on a dyno making that much power on a 2.2 with just 4 bolt on parts, track times? Any thing to back up your claims, or just speculation. And bruce you talk of building your motor than going f/i, so what pistons do you plan on going with if you want to do all motor, then switch to f/i?

rick1217

LMAO!!! Why is it that you 2.2 guys get so butthurt everytime somebody makes a thread about the 2.2 and ss/sc guys give advice or comment in it?? Like Shortbus said, WE ARE IN NO WAY HATING ON THE 2.2!! I think it would be awsome to see a +200whp N/A... but if you guys think 1-2k will cover it....you better do some more research.... it is possiable....I think a guy with a cavy 2.2eco hit around 240-250whp before, I seen on the eco forums awhile back.... but you will need more than just bolt ons....
intake, full header back exhaust, cams, port/polished head, maybe high comp pistons(wont be good if you plan on future F/I, another thing to point out, some of you guys say you want to build it N/A get over 200whp then go F/I?? thats not going to happen with high comp, unless you run 100+octane and you are a pro at tuning) etc....etc....
Also some of you say, you cant afford F/I......well building 200whp N/A WILL cost MORE... and require rebuilding the engine..... if you dont have the tools/knowledge, add another 1-2k+ on there for labour.....

Good luck to the guys that will be building the 2.2 N/A, keep us updated....
AND can we please stop comparing LS+mods to SS/SC cost.....that is getting really annoying seeing that..... I will only say this once, sure you can build a 2.2 to be faster than a ss/sc and it MIGHT cost cheaper(not by much) but you will never be able to come close overall unless you spent an extra +5k over what we spent....plus alot of us still have warranty.....By overall, I mean....Suspension/Brakes/Body/Interior/stronger drivetrain/clutch, etc. etc....I know alot of you guys will come back and say you dont care about that stuff, blah, blah......but us SS/SC guys didnt but the s/c cause it was quick of the lot, it also handled great, had good brakes, looked good, etc, etc.....thats why we bought OUR car, you guys bought yours for your reasons.....

AGAIN, I will say it, WE ARE IN NO WAY HATING ON THE 2.2!!!! cause I know a few of you might start complaining about my post, and I will most likey get an infraction again....but that just needs to be said.....
thank you.....

Novajoe

tuning is the key to every fuel injected car's power. In order to have a 4cyl powerhouse it needs to be able to scream. You gotta move alotta cfms through only 4 ports so you need to get the motor turning really fast. As far as all-motor is concerned, the faster you can get the motor turning, the more air you can move. The more air you can move, the more power you can make.

What makes it easier with f/i is that you don't have to really change the motor except for making it more durable. You can rely on an outside source to feed air to the motor instead of building the motor to do all the work. I mean, just look at motor efficiency on an f/i engine compared to a n/a.

Shortbus

Thank you, iam not hating iam just saying you think with ss/sc injectors and a 2.4 manifold, and bolt ons is going to net you that for 1-2k your dead wrong, i think some of you need to do some fine research first before you plan to do something like this.

BlackedOutCoby

No as I stated I ahve my base dyno and I just added the minimum recorded gain from each of the parts, Im not like everyone else on here saying well Im getting 11hp form ym intake.. No i added the lowest recorded whp gain from each part on top of my base. Now of course thats not a viable way to get accurate Whp but its not completely invalid either.

to Novajoe your right the average person isn't gonna be able to do a lot of the work themselves but I am the lucky one. I have complete access to a 8 bay private shop. With lifts, machine shop, and more tools then your average Dealership shop. Its nothing for me to drive my car in there in the morning do some work and drive it home a few hours later.
The exhaust I built completely custom at one of my friends nationally known welding shops. Paid him $25 to use his equipment and spent another $75 on the bulk metal tubeing, rods, and muffler.

To shortbus. Like I said gimme about 3 more weeks and I will have all the Dyno information you could possibly want. I am expecting right at 180whp... Now I could be way off or I could be right on. All I am saying right now is rarely have I been wrong about any 4cyl car related topic. Its kinda my thing, since I built my first 240SX with full Silvia conversion to my SR20DET powered sentra to the 600whp Talon TSI. I knew what I was shooting for and I figured out how to do it at teh lowest possible cost while still maintaining the highest quality of work and parts.

Brucesblack

but if you guys think 1-2k will cover it....you better do some more research.... it is possiable....I think a guy with a cavy 2.2eco hit around 240-250whp before, I seen on the eco forums awhile back.... but you will need more than just bolt ons....
intake, full header back exhaust, cams, port/polished head, maybe high comp pistons(wont be good if you plan on future F/I, another thing to point out, some of you guys say you want to build it N/A get over 200whp then go F/I?? thats not going to happen with high comp, unless you run 100+octane and you are a pro at tuning) etc....etc....
Also some of you say, you cant afford F/I......well building 200whp N/A WILL cost MORE... and require rebuilding the engine..... if you dont have the tools/knowledge, add another 1-2k+ on there for labour.....

... well you keep throwing up the $1000 -$2000 parts range .. did you not pay attention to my first couple of post's im planing on a FULL motor build not just bolt ons .. im goin all out on this car. why because i can . and it doesnt matter if the SS/SC handles better than mine stock well duh i wonder why lol .. im planing on building this car until i cant go any further . every mod i can put on this car that helps it handle better or stop better or shift better im gonna do it regardless of what other people tell me !!

g5mike

my head alone with valvetrain etc.. set me back 2500.00

BlackedOutCoby

Ohh and I still maintain a full warranty..... Rick1217 good post but I just ahve to add... for what I do my car was the right choice. I dont auto x... I have no need for a car with improved cornering ability. And on that topic for a second the suspensions on even the base cobalts are better then almost any Japanese cars I have driven and I am completely a Jap car guy. So I have to give Chevy some credit there because for a cheap ass base model balt they ride really good. Well the coupe rides really good. Ohh god how I hated my rental sedan... Felt like I was driving a bus around all day.

I mostly daily drive my car but the reason i am going for 200whp is the sleeper effect. I do street race. Almost every week. I don't race every week but I am almost always out there. Its always fun to know that there isn't a NA Honda/Toyota/Nissan in town that can hang with you. You know? Thats why lately my races have involved larger displacement cars and or Fi cars. base SRT-4's, 04+ eclipse GT, 2JZ SC300, 03/04 350Z's, 05+ Mustang V6's, supercharged focus, and 1 GTI which spanked me like nobody's buisness.

BlownSaturn

Big problem here Bruce. As has been stated already.......don't try to build a naturally aspirated motor and think you are just gonna slap a power adder on it down the road for big gains. You need to start your build up with one or the other in mind. Every good engine begins with a good plan. If you try to build this car up N/A only to switch to F/I later on you will severely limit the power adder's effectiveness. Go one way or the other on it or you will be very disappointed in the power output, reliablity, and overall engine life. If you want to build a stout 2.2 N/A and crave for more later on then nitrous oxide will be your best route. Good luck with things.

On a side note, the Ecotec is very much unlike the small block chevys of the past so don't expect a similar experience. There are few engines that can match the small chevy in cost vs performance. I've had several and it's very easy to achieve great gains with little work and money. The Ecotec is..........well, it takes a bit more finess and a whole lot more cash. I'm sure that your quest for 200 whp will help educate you further. Have fun with it

Novajoe

that's cool that you have access to a good shop, but you're kinda dreaming if you're hoping to get those #s. Thinking as different parts of your engine as their own hp adders isn't really a good way to look at it. Everything works togeather to get one figure. As an example, say you add just an intake and get 10hp out of it. Then you add an intake manifold without the intake and get 15hp. You can't automatically assume you're going to get 25hp by putting both of them on.

Go for it man throw it all togeather and put it on the dyno. I'm sure you'll see some great gains. But I doubt you'll be close to the 200whp mark with those mods.

Also as a side note, if you've never changed the clutch on a 2.2 ecotec b4, give yourself a whole day to do it. I've done at least 10 of them and it still takes me 4-5hours to do it right in a shop environment(lift, air tools, specialty tools, etc.)

BlackedOutCoby

Well this thread is jsut about done for now I guess.

rick1217

Thats fine, and I was refering to the other members that think they will net 200whp with 1-2k of bolt ons and minor work..... nobody here is telling you what you can/cant do with your car, its yours, you can do whatever you want to it......

What do you have planed for your car? are you going F/I?? whats your goal hp wise??

Shortbus

Well keep us posted on the dyno sheet.

kingg5

iTrader: (1)

geez man thats kinda like sayin modding a sc cobalt is a big waste of money when u could just go buy a sti or a evolution. you shouldnt generalize. not everyone had the money to buy the ss/sc.

if your looking for a good used head with very low kms on it ive got one for sale pm me if u want details or pics

IonNinja

I've got intake, header and a full 2.5" exhaust with a Patriot Stage 2 head and there is no way in hell I'm even remotely close to 200whp. With these mods the car would pull MAYBE a low 15 in perfect whether in somewhere other than Arizona

Without cams and a way to increase your rpms you are getting nowhere N/A on this car. To make N/A power you need high compression and high rpms and we really don't have that. 10:1 is not bad compression for N/A but that 6500 redline is gonna kill it for you and not to mention stock cams fall off around 5500.

If you don't have the money for FI then you definitely don't have the money to go for 200whp N/A because it will cost more than an FI setup and you will still make less power than someone that is FI on a bone stock motor.

So, is it possible? yes. Cost effective? no.

/thread

IonFeright

man there is no way you are even close to 175whp right now. You're running basically the same setup as me right now minus the 2.5 intake manifold and I dynoed at 180whp with a 75shot. I did put down 210 tq but there is now way your even close to 175whp.

Brucesblack

im building my motor as far as i can with how ever much money it take's im plannaing on going FI but im just gonna build my motor first then when i get done with the build .. HOPEFULLY there will be tuning avalible.. then i will go FI . which might be a SC . not a turbo .. and of course N2o

kingg5

iTrader: (1)

there is tuning available...do some research.

DarkSergeant

Didn't read all this post.
But honestly, the quickest (and most unique) way to get 200 hp out of a motor would be to yank that **** out and put a 3400 or LX9 in there. It'll fit.

BlackedOutCoby

There isnt any decent tuneing. SMT6 is a half ass way to tune and not ideal for any setup. Basically the poster you were reffering to was talking about a direct plug and play PCM tuner system like HPTuners.

IonFeright

I still want to know how youre putting down 175-180whp...

kingg5

iTrader: (1)

ahh my bad i just figured that if garret is putting a form of tuning with there alpha kit that it would be a GOOD system..not a half assed one...my bad.

mabye hes full of ****?

FuriouS

10k was an over exaggeration I know.. hahah, but its not hard to spend close to it if your including wheels, brakes, suspension, every engine mod available, exhaust, etc....Going fast is great but you want to be able to stop and turn a corner too...



Anyway I'd love to see it!

WSFrazier

It isn't a half ass why. Not every car has direct tuning available like the LSJ's. Look at SRT4 and STI drivers... how do you think they do it.

If you 2.2 owners are still waiting for HPTuners... well then you just might as well keep waiting.