finshed 2.2 super charged @ 10 psi
04-06-2007, 07:16 PM
#151
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04-06-2007, 07:54 PM
#153
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ok this is the facts
1. we ARE running the stage 2 GM injectors and pulley for the SS 2.0
2.we are NOT currently using the SMT7 but we have one we WILL use eventually.
3.if we dog it on no tune we already know it will blow up so we dont need to be told.
4.we DO have a boost gauge you can clearly see it in the video under the wiper blade, thats how we know we are making between 10-14lbs of boost.
5.we are NOT currently running a piggyback or any other means of managment other then the stock ECU.
6.the project has run about 1700-2000$ with everything including the SMT7 and water intercooler, and i dont know how to answer in comparison to the SS sc model.
7.i dont have track numbers or dyno numbers as of yet because i just got the thing together now im trying to figure our tuning the beast.
8.we are hoping to use the 3bar map with the SMT unit.
any other questions i did not get to'?
thanks for the help fellas.
1. we ARE running the stage 2 GM injectors and pulley for the SS 2.0
2.we are NOT currently using the SMT7 but we have one we WILL use eventually.
3.if we dog it on no tune we already know it will blow up so we dont need to be told.
4.we DO have a boost gauge you can clearly see it in the video under the wiper blade, thats how we know we are making between 10-14lbs of boost.
5.we are NOT currently running a piggyback or any other means of managment other then the stock ECU.
6.the project has run about 1700-2000$ with everything including the SMT7 and water intercooler, and i dont know how to answer in comparison to the SS sc model.
7.i dont have track numbers or dyno numbers as of yet because i just got the thing together now im trying to figure our tuning the beast.
8.we are hoping to use the 3bar map with the SMT unit.
any other questions i did not get to'?
thanks for the help fellas.
04-06-2007, 07:54 PM
#154
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unlike philco who gave me an infraction for the mower pic in my sig being VERY slightly too big instead of giving me any kind of warning or anything like that 
then i got banned by a drunken mod that same day
then when made a post about it on another name that same day i got a nasty pm and got banned again
anywho. on topic-
i agree with tcarter on this one, this setup is not safe the way it is, and i would not be driving the thing as is. Im amazed he hasnt blown his motor yet....
then i got banned by a drunken mod that same day
then when made a post about it on another name that same day i got a nasty pm and got banned again
anywho. on topic-
i agree with tcarter on this one, this setup is not safe the way it is, and i would not be driving the thing as is. Im amazed he hasnt blown his motor yet....
04-06-2007, 08:02 PM
#156
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....good call chief.
But im not gonna flame, PERSONALY, I wouldnt drive the car (especialy 40 miles) with no fuel solution.
like i said, i congradulated you on being a pioneer. but its not cool to turn around and call me out on my knowledge.....you sir are in no position to be making fun of someone (especialy from me seeing your desktop wallpaper).
But im not gonna flame, PERSONALY, I wouldnt drive the car (especialy 40 miles) with no fuel solution.
like i said, i congradulated you on being a pioneer. but its not cool to turn around and call me out on my knowledge.....you sir are in no position to be making fun of someone (especialy from me seeing your desktop wallpaper).
To all the others who posted "helpful" comments, shame on you. This guy just accomplished something that a bunch of you have been talking about doing for a long long time. You call him a liar.........he gives you proof (on his lunchbreak none the less!!!). Then you offer up your "helpful" comments. Could you be any more negative? Is it your car or motor in the video? No it's not. So layoff of him. If you have some useful advice then perhaps you should learn to state it in a useful way. shortbus.net FTL on this thread.
Yellowshowbalt (or his friend), maybe you should take this project over to the redlineforums where people are (for the most part) much more mature, informative, and above all.........courteous.
Great job on this project so far. Now you just gotta shore up the holes and you'll have one bad little balt
04-06-2007, 08:09 PM
#157
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Ok, I just wanted to know how you were planning on using the Bar MAP sensor.
Also, if you know the engine is going to blow up, why are you getting into boost pressure without fuel management?
In my opinion, none of this should have been installed UNTIL you had all the parts to do so or atleast, you shouldn't driving the car around getting into boost UNTIL you had it properly setup.
You are looking at this in the wrong manner.
No one is getting on him because he did the swap...I wasn't even calling him a liar. I never said he didn't have ***** for atleast doing it and you're right, most people talk the talk but don't walk it.
My thing is that he is doing this partially correct. He's riding around video taping himself getting into boost pressure...yes, he has larger injectors but he has NO type of control of them. Whether he is going to get a SMT later isn't of the importance. He has nothing now. it's not like he is reaching...1...possibly 2 PSI of boost pressure...he's reaching 10+! He even says how it's leaning out.
To me, it's obvious he knows what he's doing but chooses to ignore the basics or the logic behind it.
I have a question about this...
Where do you plan on placing this MAP sensor?
Also, if you know the engine is going to blow up, why are you getting into boost pressure without fuel management?
In my opinion, none of this should have been installed UNTIL you had all the parts to do so or atleast, you shouldn't driving the car around getting into boost UNTIL you had it properly setup.
I think that you are refering to yellowshowbalt with that comment. He was not the one speaking though. It was his friend logged on under his screenname. Not that it matters, it's no excuse to criticise his speech or appearance. In this thread your age is very apparent.
To all the others who posted "helpful" comments, shame on you. This guy just accomplished something that a bunch of you have been talking about doing for a long long time. You call him a liar.........he gives you proof (on his lunchbreak none the less!!!). Then you offer up your "helpful" comments. Could you be any more negative? Is it your car or motor in the video? No it's not. So layoff of him. If you have some useful advice then perhaps you should learn to state it in a useful way. shortbus.net FTL on this thread.
Yellowshowbalt (or his friend), maybe you should take this project over to the redlineforums where people are (for the most part) much more mature, informative, and above all.........courteous.
Great job on this project so far. Now you just gotta shore up the holes and you'll have one bad little balt
To all the others who posted "helpful" comments, shame on you. This guy just accomplished something that a bunch of you have been talking about doing for a long long time. You call him a liar.........he gives you proof (on his lunchbreak none the less!!!). Then you offer up your "helpful" comments. Could you be any more negative? Is it your car or motor in the video? No it's not. So layoff of him. If you have some useful advice then perhaps you should learn to state it in a useful way. shortbus.net FTL on this thread.
Yellowshowbalt (or his friend), maybe you should take this project over to the redlineforums where people are (for the most part) much more mature, informative, and above all.........courteous.
Great job on this project so far. Now you just gotta shore up the holes and you'll have one bad little balt
No one is getting on him because he did the swap...I wasn't even calling him a liar. I never said he didn't have ***** for atleast doing it and you're right, most people talk the talk but don't walk it.
My thing is that he is doing this partially correct. He's riding around video taping himself getting into boost pressure...yes, he has larger injectors but he has NO type of control of them. Whether he is going to get a SMT later isn't of the importance. He has nothing now. it's not like he is reaching...1...possibly 2 PSI of boost pressure...he's reaching 10+! He even says how it's leaning out.
To me, it's obvious he knows what he's doing but chooses to ignore the basics or the logic behind it.
8.we are hoping to use the 3bar map with the SMT unit.
Where do you plan on placing this MAP sensor?
Last edited by NJHK; 04-06-2007 at 08:09 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
04-06-2007, 08:11 PM
#158
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Thread Starter
Ok, I just wanted to know how you were planning on using the Bar MAP sensor.
Also, if you know the engine is going to blow up, why are you getting into boost pressure without fuel management?
In my opinion, none of this should have been installed UNTIL you had all the parts to do so or atleast, you shouldn't driving the car around getting into boost UNTIL you had it properly setup.
Also, if you know the engine is going to blow up, why are you getting into boost pressure without fuel management?
In my opinion, none of this should have been installed UNTIL you had all the parts to do so or atleast, you shouldn't driving the car around getting into boost UNTIL you had it properly setup.
well it seems that since the blower has been ported it takes a minute or some real "juicing" to "spool" it or get any type or pressure, and since this thread has started we added a MBC and have it connected to the stock blower wastegate and it only allows now 8-10psi which is still alow but it alot better now that we are not hitting 14.
the stock fuel system seems to be compensating thats why we are driving it, the wideband doesnt lie. and we do have the injectors, there are a few areas that can even be leaned out.
04-06-2007, 08:14 PM
#159
Senior Member
And when you hit 10 PSI, what a/f ratio are you?
When I watched your video, you were revving it and it was hitting 11s. Fine...it's in open loop. But when you boosting, what was your a/f?
When I watched your video, you were revving it and it was hitting 11s. Fine...it's in open loop. But when you boosting, what was your a/f?
04-06-2007, 08:15 PM
#160
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Thread Starter
"He even says how it's leaning out."
i think you need to watch the video again, there is a part of it where you can watch the wideband... this baby is riching up to 8.8 on the wideband with the stock fuel pump. its only leaning when you let off the throttle and thats because it cuts fuel.... its supposed to.
i think you need to watch the video again, there is a part of it where you can watch the wideband... this baby is riching up to 8.8 on the wideband with the stock fuel pump. its only leaning when you let off the throttle and thats because it cuts fuel.... its supposed to.
04-06-2007, 08:22 PM
#161
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Congratulations on the project!
Sure he sits around 11:1 afr when light on the gas, and 14-15:1 at idle, but did anyone else see when he droped to 8:1?
Edit:So I'm not the only one.^^^^
So i'm curious what he is going to do about timing. The SMT can't change that right?
I'm curious because I plan on doing the same project w/ the GM kit in about 5 or 6 months.
Sure he sits around 11:1 afr when light on the gas, and 14-15:1 at idle, but did anyone else see when he droped to 8:1?
Edit:So I'm not the only one.^^^^
So i'm curious what he is going to do about timing. The SMT can't change that right?
I'm curious because I plan on doing the same project w/ the GM kit in about 5 or 6 months.
04-06-2007, 08:25 PM
#162
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Thread Starter
Ok, I just wanted to know how you were planning on using the Bar MAP sensor.
Also, if you know the engine is going to blow up, why are you getting into boost pressure without fuel management?
In my opinion, none of this should have been installed UNTIL you had all the parts to do so or atleast, you shouldn't driving the car around getting into boost UNTIL you had it properly setup.
Also, if you know the engine is going to blow up, why are you getting into boost pressure without fuel management?
In my opinion, none of this should have been installed UNTIL you had all the parts to do so or atleast, you shouldn't driving the car around getting into boost UNTIL you had it properly setup.
well it seems that since the blower has been ported it takes a minute or some real "juicing" to "spool" it or get any type or pressure, and since this thread has started we added a MBC and have it connected to the stock blower wastegate and it only allows now 8-10psi which is still alow but it alot better now that we are not hitting 14.
the stock fuel system seems to be compensating thats why we are driving it, the wideband doesnt lie. and we do have the injectors, there are a few areas that can even be leaned out.
04-06-2007, 08:26 PM
#164
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Holy smokes guys, some of you throwing insults are also spewing some of the most incorrect facts on how engine management works on these cars.
First, to all of you, this is entirely possible to do without issue or even aftermarket fuel management. PERIOD! Because these cars use the MAF (Mass airflow sensor) as a primary means of metering air, it makes it easier and heres why for those of you who don't understand.
He moved the map sensor from the orignial location to a place before the compressor (blower) so it will never see boost (to the OP, thats the location of the supercharger inlet pressure sensor, not the air intake temperature sensor). This prevents overvoltage problems and the PCM will not ignore the readings. Now remember, as long as the reading is within a broad range of being accurate, thats all it needs to be, since it uses MAF and not MAP to fuel.
When you add a blower, you increase the amount of air being drawn into the engine. By design, a MAF will compensate, but it may go over its physical limit. If it does, it will use the MAP or TPS as a backup.
The MAP sensor is there only for electonic throttle correlation checks. It compares the MAP reading to the MAF and if they are fairly close, the tests pass and you do not go into limp mode.
To the OP, the only suggestion I have for you is to change the 2 bar sensor back to a 1 bar sensor. The voltage output is only half of what it needs to be. Also a MAF translator will help you if you are hitting the limit of the stock MAF and want to put a larger one on.
First, to all of you, this is entirely possible to do without issue or even aftermarket fuel management. PERIOD! Because these cars use the MAF (Mass airflow sensor) as a primary means of metering air, it makes it easier and heres why for those of you who don't understand.
He moved the map sensor from the orignial location to a place before the compressor (blower) so it will never see boost (to the OP, thats the location of the supercharger inlet pressure sensor, not the air intake temperature sensor). This prevents overvoltage problems and the PCM will not ignore the readings. Now remember, as long as the reading is within a broad range of being accurate, thats all it needs to be, since it uses MAF and not MAP to fuel.
When you add a blower, you increase the amount of air being drawn into the engine. By design, a MAF will compensate, but it may go over its physical limit. If it does, it will use the MAP or TPS as a backup.
The MAP sensor is there only for electonic throttle correlation checks. It compares the MAP reading to the MAF and if they are fairly close, the tests pass and you do not go into limp mode.
To the OP, the only suggestion I have for you is to change the 2 bar sensor back to a 1 bar sensor. The voltage output is only half of what it needs to be. Also a MAF translator will help you if you are hitting the limit of the stock MAF and want to put a larger one on.
04-06-2007, 08:38 PM
#168
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3rd picture on page 6 is the fatory one i going to try to use. im still useint the stock 2.2 map sensor i moved it from the plastic intake to the inlet air temp sersor and bent the bracket to hold it in
04-06-2007, 08:39 PM
#169
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I was going to say, try using the original sensor that was there from the supercharger, but I think its a 2 bar as well.
Out of curiousity, why are you changing it to a higher capacity MAP?
Out of curiousity, why are you changing it to a higher capacity MAP?
04-06-2007, 08:49 PM
#171
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it starts droping from 14s at idle. and when it starts boost it go's richer 3-5 pounds is 13-12s and 8-10 pounds is 11-10s and 14ish is 9-8s its dumping fuel the more boost i get im not realy trying to blow it up but i am wanting to see what every little bit can do
04-06-2007, 08:50 PM
#172
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Just found this thread... The vid is a little scary the AFR hits really lean but it sounds like the motor is running strong! Just asking....anyone chime in here pls .... does the 2.2 computer properly read the 2 bar sensor if it had only 1 bar factory? I'm confused with this, pls explain!
Dude, seems like you have tackled this project head on and I hope everything works out for you! but untill your 100%(at least 90%) sure its running within ranges the motor can handle be care full with the accelerator! Congrats and good luck!
Dude, seems like you have tackled this project head on and I hope everything works out for you! but untill your 100%(at least 90%) sure its running within ranges the motor can handle be care full with the accelerator! Congrats and good luck!
04-06-2007, 08:53 PM
#173
Senior Member
it starts droping from 14s at idle. and when it starts boost it go's richer 3-5 pounds is 13-12s and 8-10 pounds is 11-10s and 14ish is 9-8s its dumping fuel the more boost i get im not realy trying to blow it up but i am wanting to see what every little bit can do
That's unglodly rich if you're reaching 9s!
But yeah, how do you plan on getting the piggyback hooked up?
04-06-2007, 08:54 PM
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Just found this thread... The vid is a little scary the AFR hits really lean but it sounds like the motor is running strong! Just asking....anyone chime in here pls .... does the 2.2 computer properly read the 2 bar sensor if it had only 1 bar factory? I'm confused with this, pls explain!
Dude, seems like you have tackled this project head on and I hope everything works out for you! but untill your 100%(at least 90%) sure its running within ranges the motor can handle be care full with the accelerator! Congrats and good luck!
Dude, seems like you have tackled this project head on and I hope everything works out for you! but untill your 100%(at least 90%) sure its running within ranges the motor can handle be care full with the accelerator! Congrats and good luck!