cobalt_driver

Okay, Im looking to make my 06 LS faster than an SS. I want to go forged how ever I've only found one site for forged internals. Also, if I go with biger internals I would have to upgrade the fuel rail and injectors right? Also, I heard that if I bore out the pistons, I wouldnt be able to run a turbo or supercharger because Id blow the engine. I have never heard of such a thing because I thought the purpose of going forged was to strengthen the internals so you can support nirtous or a turbo or supercharger. I would just like some help here. I really dont know alot about engines here, and Im just looking for some help. Any help would be great.

Also, if anyone can help me because Id have to upgrade the computer too, and I havent found anywhere that has one. I just need some help all around. lol. THANX.

glockglade

Take your LS back and buy an SS easiest solution to your problem plain and simple.

NJHK

You can get forged internals through most of the vendors on this site.

The question is, what are you looking to gain from changing your bottom end internals? Are you raising or lowering the compression? Are you going the boost route or staying naturally aspirated.

You aren't changing your fuel system because you changed your internals, per say. You need to understand why you would be changing your fuel system in the first place. Please read this fuel system faq http://www.ecotecforum.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2743

Also, Forged Internals are just stronger and better quality...not necessarily bigger. If they are bigger, they are either wider (larger bore) or taller/shorter (which effects compression).

You need to ultimately figure out what you're aiming for....

Also, you wouldn't "blow" the engine just because you went f/i. Even if you had f/i on forged internals, you could still blow it if you don't know what you're doing (mainly on engine/fuel management side).

06Pursuit

iTrader: (1)

i don't mean to hijack but this looked like the best place to place. Can someone tell me the diffrence between I-Beam, H-Beam, and X-Beam con rods besides that they look like the letter in their name....NJHK? im lookin at u bud lol

Witt

H Beam

I Beam

X Beam

No idea which ones are best, other than I'm told H are usually the strongest.

The_Blur

The next time someone says this, I'm going to smack them.

There are a lot of personal reasons to buy one car or the other. If they have the LS, don't tell them they made the wrong choice. It was the right choice for them.

rally

I do hate when people say "Take your LS back and get an SS"

Currently I have an LS, paid 13K or so for it, If I get the procharger kit I'm looking at thats looking to put me anywhere from 205 to 225 whp on a base kit, and they retail around 3-4K.

If you do the math, 13+3 to 4K nets you 16 or 17K, beating an SS for cheaper...Priceless

montecarloman

This is how this goes; you can’t do anything that matters until the 2.2 gets serious computer support. As I understand it there are companies that can program your computer to match your setup. Unfortunately that means that either you do everything all at once or go through a long drawn out process making upgrades then getting the ECU reprogrammed. I am waiting for something like HP Tuners to come out with a program on the fly for our cars before I do anything. Until then I'd recommend saving your money and learning everything you can about not just the ecotec but every internal combustion engine you can. HP Books and SA Design both put out great books loaded with information. I'd recommend “John Lingenfelter on Modifying Small-Block Chevy" to start. Sure it’s about small blocks but it’s still an internal combustion engine and the theories in it apply.

Drakonen2000

I beam = your typical stuff..street and strip

H beam = your typical race stuff...mostly strip with a few high end street apps.

X beam = race all tha way....

the different designs allow the rod to retain its shape when more force is applied by the piston being blown down by the combustion stroke of the engine

rally

Not entirely true. You can use piggybacks if you really want forced induction, theres just kinks to work out in certain areas of that.

Theres currently a 2.2 turbo cobalt thats an everyday driver that is running off a piggy back

Plus if you haven't been around for a few months SCT Flash is supporting our computers, so no need for HPT

montecarloman

My apologies cobalt_driver, rallyyellow06 set me straight on the programing front. Figured I'd post it up for any and all https://www.cobaltss.net/forums/show...ight=SCT+Flash

06Pursuit

iTrader: (1)

perfect thx for the info

LandonElf

Though i do support the 2.2 guys going for big numbers, 225whp on a stock 2.2 liter is probably not gonna happen. Well not for long anyway

I know you have a gazillion more posts than me, but i just had to call you out on this.

The procharger may only be 4 grand, but then you have the installation, tuning, injectors, exhaust, axles, intercooler, heat exchanger, clutch, etc. And thats not even getting into internals work.

So your definately gonna dip into SS/SC range with that. But hey, i would LOVE to see a budget 2.2l build that would smoke a 2.0. They would be my hero!!!

rally

Actually check out speedmafia.com

225 was holding easy. Internals are good for 250 hp. And you can keep your original exhaust. Axles will hold up well, you don't need an intercooler on the base unit either.

Its well worth the money, check it out. An Ion member on here is running it in his 2.2 on stock internals still I believe

bc3tech

seriously the next time somebody says the 2.2 is capable of anything less than 250 i'ma smack them. it's been proven pushed to the 280 range on boost.
procharger FULL INSTALL was under $4k for me. that includes tuning (piggyback DFMU/SAFC no CEL), 2 core FMIC w/ piping, all gauges (boost, fuel pressure, AFR), gauge pod, alternator pulley (smooth), bypass valve, wideband o2 sensor.

heat exchanger? not needed. Clutch? not needed. Axles? not needed. I'm at 188whp on a **** tune as the tuning setup i have is less than optimal. The tuning setup I'll be getting in april is that of the Turbo 2.2 cobalt running 10psi (same as me) and pushing 212whp. Keep in mind this is also w/ a monster 3.45" pulley. (it's so big i have to have a spacer in it or it rubs on the bracket bolts)

y'all need to do your research before you spout off what the 2.2 can and cannot do. seriously.
speedmafia FTW. Internals are rated by GM for 250hp, and held up to 283 on n2o (much more violent combustion than boost)

back to the discussion at hand:
Eagle forged rods, Diamond or Wiseco Pistons (10.5 / 11:1 compression), and a Patriot Stage 2 head w/ valvetrain will get you some nice prep for tuning. That's my current plan, and will be enacted about April this year. Hopefully by then SCT or Diablo will have come out w/ something that can bump my rev limit to 7500. At any rate, w/ or w/o ECM tuning i'll be 300whp+ w/ the Procharger & SMT-6 Piggyback unit.

[link to related post]

BaltM62

2.2 guys are funny.

IonNinja

your blower is small.

rick1217

GOOD LUCK!

I doubt that is less then 4g but whatever....just a few questions though....why do you have a AFR gauge and a wideband.(The wideband should come with its own AFR gauge)
Your "monster" pulley that is .1" bigger than our stock pulley, you put a spacer in it? wouldnt that make the belt not line up with the rest of the pulleys???
http://speedmafia.com/Online%20Store...Stage%20II.htm
This is the kit you have?? 3800 plus wideband, gauge pod, 3 gauges, anything else?? sounds like more then 4k.....
"When" your at +300whp? let us know how much you spent
Wonder how much the F23 can handle if 2.0 guys are blown F35 tannys already....

I have nothing against the 2.2 or people that mod the 2.2 but its just funny seeing some of you guys talk.... saying it can be made to beat a ss/sc, maybe a stock one but all a ss/sc needs is 500-1000 worth of mods. It will take a 2.2 probally 5-10G to beat a ss/sc with 1k of mods and the ss/sc will be more reliable and require less work to get to a certain goal.

How much more is a ss/sc?? 5-10k??
IMO i think it is worth it
Stronger, more powerful engine
Stronger tranny
better clutch
stiffer and lowered suspension
body kit
rims
bigger brakes and rear disc
nicer interior
optional recaros and LSD
already forced induction, easy to mod
requires less work/money to see big gains
Anything else that I missed?

Again, I am not knocking on the 2.2s, if just getting tried of see all these guys saying that the 2.2 can beat a 2.0 and its better, etc, etc....
Good luck to you 2.2 guys that are going F/I but it isnt going to be cheap if you want it to be reliable aswell....
If you disagree, please comment back, I am not tring to bash the 2.2 guys, I am just tring to make a point....

NoRemorse

I got my ION Redline for 18k new. Having more power, and better handling, while stock, than a car that spent the same with MUCHO in mods and a hell of a lot of headache.... priceless

I am not saying that going your route is wrong, nor do i endorse people saying 'should have got an SS, but you can;t make the money argument very well, you get the stuff A LOT cheaper if you buy it on the car OEM.

bc3tech

sweet jesus you're really spouting off on something you've never seen? wow. this is just hilarious.
would you like to see the paperwork for the purchase since u think it's less than 4g's?
XD-16 gauge does NOT come with a wideband.
and how many of y'all have dropped from 2.8 to 2.7? or 2.7 to 2.6? does it make a difference?
you're absolutely right, my ****'s totally out of alignment and making 10psi. yup.
i got nearly everything in that kit separately from other places and pieced it all together.
will do
driver mod FTW

nobody can ever dispute the old "no replacement for displacement". i'll let my build speak for itself. some of us LIKE to build our own ****.

stronger yes, more powerful no. if you would take the S/C off, it would be weaker. less displacement, less compression. on identical setups, the 2.2 will put out more power.
boost isn't very hard on a transmission due to the gradual increase in tq
yup and for $400 i can have a stronger one than the ss/sc
springs, yay. i've already got sway bars
woooo.....
rear disc doesn't do much. braking force is put primarily on the fronts. and a front big brake upgrade is a grand. woo.

recaros are nice, i plan on racing seats. LSD yup, same amt extra for you as it is for me to get one and put it in.
whoopee, F/I here. as far as easy to mod, ok honda.
ok honda.
sounds to me like you are
who said that?
going on 4000mi and i beat the hell outta my car every day.


who's car u referring to? i don't know any 2.2's that had any headache... just tuning issues


anyway, you SS/SC guys clearly know all there is to know about the 2.2L so i'll just let this thread go on. If anybody w/ a 2.2 wants to talk about engine modding, just PM me.

LandonElf

I think you misunderstand. Were not saying the 2.2 CANT handle the power, were saying that to GET the power, it would take money that would be better spent on just buying the SS/SC.

Guys are getting 250hp out of 19K cars with 2000 dollars worth of mods. And many of them are still under warranty!

Nobody is bashing the 2.2l, but arguing that it is a better project car than a car that has everything on it upgraded for performance is proposterous. (sp?)

bc3tech

and my 14k 2.2L + 4k worth of mods will be at 230whp (270 crank) after my pulley & injector swap in a week. that's an 18k car. and i'm JUST within my warranty still (34k) and the dealership hasn't voided it and they've seen the procharger setup in full effect.
Add the $2k engine build on that, and i'll be at 300whp for $20k.

u were close.. it's preposterous.


to me, a project car entails a challenge or more work than would otherwise need to be done. granted, if i could have afforded the redline when I got my 2.2 I'd have done it (then). but that's where I was and this is where I am. If i were to do it over now, i'd go with a 2.4 and go the same route as I have.

LandonElf

College edgimication FTW!!!!

NoRemorse

But I spent 18k on my car, and got 223whp stock, with NO worries about warranty at ANY dealer. Also would be a hell of a lot more reliable, as it was all stock.

Of course, 5k later on my car... I am going to be way into the 300's as far as power

bc3tech

after the 18k mark here (the 4k i've put in) i should be at the ~215 mark once I get the SMT-6 installed.

after 5k & 300whp on your car you're at 23k, i'll be at 6k & 300whp for a total of $20k. to equal the 23k, i'd have to have put 9k into mine, and i better be well into the 300s (****, 4 or 500s) by then.

my main point here is this. y'all are talking about something you haven't done, haven't researched, and haven't seen. with the exception of NR cuz i know he's been following my build and planning on a 2.2 / 2.4 of his own.