Got my springs on friday. No time to install over the weekend and at this rate it might have to wait until next weekend. They are taunting me in the box in my room...

 

Sigh..... Its obvious you are offended by reading these responses. Like I said I just wanted a non-biased objective review which I don't think a cobalt owner could give unless he/she was not aware of what springs they were driving on prior to the comparison.

Would it be possible to make a revision that lowered the car a bit more or would that throw off the way the spring works? I honestly think many people who would buy these wouldnt bc these still look close to stock ride height and we all know many people prefer a bit lower ride. I'll be honest I would sacrifice a bit of handling to achieve the look I want. I'm sure many others are in the same boat.

Please try not to be condescending when you respond.

 

if they prefer lower they have tons of options out there.... the stricly performance group has well.... none.......... except powell now

SSC's seem to be that fit your describing and that's the spring everyone seems to choose for the "i want to handle better, but want low in mind" mentality. Powell made this strictly for performance, so if the customer wants the low ride with decent performance what would stop them from just going to another brand of spring thats out there already? Powell is making something different for the performance only oriented group (which may be larger than you think once you get past the OMGGGG 4x4 LOWER THAT P.O.S. CSS POSSE MENTALITY)

 

If you didnt characterize folks who like these springs as nutswingers, maybe you would get nice responses.
"I will be honest"
I am always thinking of the next step with everything we make and do. I have been researching how to do a spring that slams the car without losing performance.Dropped spindles do that; we already drop the beam. dropped struts are possible, and you could use our springs.ya never know. Maybe I will come up with something for the bottom crawlers...the rollin' sketch crowd...

I am also curious how you can say that " a cobalt owner could not give an objective review if they were not aware of what springs they were driving on?? Like really... they either have stock like Stealth TC, or something else, like Slvred or Revolution they put on. Not sure how they could not know what they had on their cars .
Regardless, driving their car against mine, or their car before/after, any owner is qualified to give an opinion. Its easy actually. Go over some bumps. car doesnt shut off? its good.

 

I went back to read my posts and as I thought, I never once used the word, "nutswinger" nor did I even imply anyone would be such. As a matter of FACT, I did state that you have a very deserved loyal following.

My comment about a Cobalt owner not giving an objective review is b/c I am assuming any Cobalt driver would have bias if they knew they were riding on your springs. It was just a gross assumption.

Basically, somone go hire Tsuchiya (spelling?) or Tiff Nadell and have them do the comparison. Joking aside, I guess I'll just have to wait for someone local to me to get these and I'll drive on them myself.

 

Again you're sort of making my point. People will go another route but I don't understand why we can't have the best of both worlds (maybe thats where the full coil over system comes in...)?

I don't think Powell intentionally designed these knowing they would be close to stock ride height. I imagine (please correct me if I'm wrong) that it was a result of the specs he wanted. Nothing wrong with it, though. I just have a certain look I want coupled with good handling. Maybe its not in the cards going this route. Thats why I wanted an objective comparison review. Hoping it would sway me b/c I do autocross when I can and I always enjoy a car that handles well and could see ignoring ride height if the handling was that much better than my Pedders.

Am I being out of line here? Seriously, I had no intention. Is questioning him Taboo??

 

your not being out of line at all....


but i guess from how I'm looking at it is why design a spring similar to whats out there already when the market is already taken by another brand... could improvements be had? possibly, but would it be worth the design time? debatable..... I'd be willing to bet people care more about ride height and smoothness than how they actually perform when you get into that "moderate to low" drop segment. Then it comes down to price as well, and something tells me the cheaper spring will still outsell... I know I was that way when I bought my Progress springs on my LT compared to SSC's

I'll let ya take mine for a spin whenever it is I get these YYZ's... still saving lol

 

I think I have answered your question clearly. Thanks for your interest.

 

Forget that have the Top Gear Stig drive em, LOL.

Stock ride height YYZ springs for performance... Most daily driven cars never see the track and the ones that do spend the money on coilovers. "wanted to do something different than what is out there" = Marketing fail. People buy based on Value (value defined as price paid for what you get).

CM makes a great spring for half the price of these.
Pedders is overpriced.
Eibach Sportline has been around forever and is priced right.

I understand Powell has a reputation and is known on these forums but the avg or informed buyer doesnt hang around reading css.net or care what the car used to be in its hayday. Things have moved on for GM. Established parts are already available and will look better lowered. Why not be competitive?

I guess I dont have the post count to understand why people would pay 340 dollars shipped for a spring marketed as performance based on some guys review and doesnt provide any aesthetics (lowering). But there seems to be a lot of people here willing to throw out their new CM springs just cause its the new forum fad. I for one am keeping my CM's.

Flame suit on, I am now labled, and just saying. Sorry if it comes off harsh.

 

I would try the camber bolt, to start with. the upper plates are not cheap. if you like the result, then I would enlarge the strut to suit.

 

I prodded John to make these because the rest of the market out there is crap. All the ones you listed above are junk if you want to go fast. I intend on going faster at the track than I did on Pedders, and I will. The car feels better and better, thanks in large part to John. Let me help you out with those quality springs you listed above.

• Eibach has had springs break, and their swaybars snap. Look around on this forum. WAAAAY too low for the soft rates
• CM/SSC is too soft, and wrong spring rates. Plus it's way too low, and you crash the bump stops.
• Pedders were too soft, crashed bump stops, inconsistent rates, powder coating issues. Helped my car result in torn rear twisting beam bushing, which in turn helped bend a rear shock.
• Stance, Pedders, BC, Megan coilovers: Oh hey, let's take 6 inches of travel and reduce that to 1-2 inches. That isn't going to suck for performance or ride quality at all, right? As an added bonus, pick rates that are too low, and shock/strut valving that is about as complex as something you built as a kid on an RC car. The good part is that they only break welds a small percent of the time now, and less people crash, but you might still get to be one of those lucky ones.
• KW: best of crappy choices. Good shock valving. Poor spring rate data and selection. Pricey. Not an awful choice if you have to pick something off the shelf, but you will still blow out the struts and shocks if you slam it.

Currently down to 3:06 - 3:07 at VIR Grand. That's the same one as Car and Driver's lightning lap. Will see how fast I go next time around, with less power, but better handling. I've been slightly detuning the car to have it run longer sessions.

VIR Grand West, Trackdaze 11-14-11 - YouTube

You can go back to your cave now.

 

I dont see the flame suit needed. The YYZ are not stock ride height of a TC which itself is 10mm lower than the SC which are both lower by far than the base cars. and to your point that people who track Cobalts go to coil overs, that is only true for Grand Am and similar competition where folks ante up 5-7000 dollars for Koni, or Ohlins coil overs. The regular 1200 coil overs sold here dont hack it on the race track at all.


CM springs lose rate and eventually will fall out at the rear by themselves if not ghetto'd in place. Or break. If that floats your boat, fine. if you dont keep your car that long , fine too. The are very inexpensive.

it costs money for good material. I was shocked at the material analysis of Pedders; I beleieved their web site when they said made in australia. I dont think they are.

I ran eibachs for a while. The were soft as heck and bottomed out with all coils over bumps. The broke and I threw them away. I was shocked at that, I thought eibach made good stuff. Their rear sway bar was a joke. it broke. They made a change. It still breaks.

Many people on here and in real life drive on roads where spring travel is needed. Otherwise the car is a pita to drive. If you drive a car over bumps and it shuts off, the springs are an issue. That has happened to more than one Cobalt owner.

For 200 bucks, CM springs are cheep. 185 on a group buy I saw the other day.

for 310 bucks, the YYZ springs are not cheap, but they are made in the USA of the best possible spring material, are progressive ,which no other aftermarket spring is, and are stiffer at compression than anyother spring and finally, provide more travel than any other aftermarket spring out there; this is a performance spring.

and I am working on a way to give the lo rider crowd something they can use as well, short of air bags. But like anything else it takes time to do it right, and in the meantime every person who has tried YYZ springs says the same thing. "its night and day how well they ride, and how firm they are when you push it"

So thats where we are todau.

 

wangspeed does an awesome job driving; he is good at analyzing and understanding the art and science of suspension. This is not a love in, its a fact. He lets other people who are faster than he drive his car. This is the mark of a true enthusiast.

I consult to HSD. we see broken coil overs everyday. Even stopped selling 06 up Honda coil overs. 3/4 of an inch in rebound travel. Can u imagine? its crazy. Moar low

 

I have SSC's and i must say, they ride much better than my Sportlines, but i still hit the bump stops and. luckily im running Koni Yellows, so the rebound is smooth. if i had teh cash i would upgrade tomorrow. hoping to get some OT in and pick these up before Aug. 31st when the price may change!

I also DD my car, has 162K miles on it, but why slow down? if you dont enjoy it, it aint worth driving!

 

Just put 1000 miles on my YYZs this weekend with girl in the car. She hated the Pedders ride but didn't complain about these and was amazed at how we took exits so fast. "That felt easy!" Her words not mine

 

Damn Powell I thought 310 was cheap for a specifically(custom) designed spring for those junkies who love the twisties.
UPS says mine will be here weds, hopefully be able to install by the weekend and hit some switchbacks after an alignment

 

so all good! I am so pleased that it rides and handles well for you. Thanks for the thread and for your business.

 

Going a route that you can achieve a low look, and still perform very well, is where a full coilover system would normally come in. However, in the Cobalt world, unless powell comes up with something, this likely isn't gonna happen. It's not like other car markets where you have every single major manufacturer coming up with solutions to everyone's desire for their car, which is part of why I moved to the evo world. You're not gonna find a set of Ohlins coilovers for balt's for $3k and be able to be, about as low as a medium drop spring like SSC, and perform VERY well. The cobalt market is, not only not large enough, but WAY to cheap for this to ever happen. At some point, you have to realize, in a market like the cobalt's have, you HAVE to make sacrafices. You cannot have the best of both worlds, because the market just isn't there.

So maybe YYZ springs aren't for you, they aren't intended to be. They weren't designed for people who care about a drop, they're only intended for those who want to actually improve handling. Lowering the car too much hurts handling, because you are losing very important suspension travel. Sitting too low causes you to sit on the bump stops more, which does not improve handling at all, and will cause understeer, something that Cobalt's already have plenty of.

 

I got more business for you as soon as you find that removal tool!

 

lol I think warren has it....check with gloria lol

 

new tires this weekend then will have to order the rest of my suspension parts john

started new job so cant blow $2k in one month lol still waiting on the address to ship off my front konis to tho lol thanks love you! lol

 

Mike I got old timers disease, email gloria.. thanks

 

haha all good just did thanks john!

 

I look forward to Wangspeeds results and also to the future of what comes of the attempt to make a, "Moar Low" version.

 

Thanks for the very well written reply but a true "enthusiast" wouldn't be driving a cobalt, lol, so anyway a lot of people have something to prove and I just don't buy into it. I do however have a very large desire for some of your more useful parts (rotated mounts, braking)
CM is the only springs I would run out of the ones listed here, "enthusiasts" mention that they are too soft but they are near stock rates. How can that be a bad thing since the car was proven in the Nürburgring.
Thanks for making parts for our cars btw, you are respected for a reason.