So tonight I was at the snow cone stand with a friend of mine that drives a 35th Mustang. I was just hanging out checking out the cars when a really tall guy walks up to me and asks if its my Mustang. I told him no and pointed him in the direction of the owner. Knowing what was gonna happen I followed him and introduced the two. The tall guy asked my friend if he wanted to race his Camaro. My friend asked if it was a V8 and it was, my friend told him he didn't know. At that point I stepped up to the plate and told him I would race him - he told me "not a chance in hell I would win" My friend ballsed up and told him he would. The tall guy started walking around the Mustang checking it out so we went over to his Camaro. Well it was an 85 and it had a 305 block, dumped exhaust and no cats. Oh yeah, and the interior was completely stripped down to two seats - he didn't even have a shift knob! They agree to do it on the highway, even up, 3 beeps and go. Well I wanted to watch so I told my friend I was going to follow him. So we start up and leave, during the process of that we attracted the attention of a Civic, body kit, exhaust, normal stuff. So the four of us are heading down the highway. The Mustang in the fastlane, Camaro beside him, Me 20 yards behind the Camaro, and the Civic next to me - just revin' away. So I thought, what the hell, might as well own all three at the same time. The race started at about 50mph, my friend did the honking (which I think is so gay - a real race starts from zero). On three I dropped to second and floored it, I was on the ass of that Camaro so fast I actually lifted off the gas because I would of hit him. The Civic just kinda dissapeared at the start - pretty lame - he should of stayed at home with mommy. The highway opened to 3 lanes and I shifted 3rd dodged for that lane and gave it all. If it was actually a 4 car race, I would of won by a mile, the Mustang behind me, the Camaro, and then the Civic. After the race back at the Snow Cone stand the Camaro driver demanded to konw what mods the Mustang had. He's only done exhaust and intake. Turns out the Camaro had a .30 overbore along with a port'n'polish. And he was beat'n by a mostly stock V6 Mustang! HAHAHA - Should of used that money on a 350 Swap

And that was my adventure for the night

 

Yeah, I tried to get a camaro to race just this past weekend, but he didn't want anything to do with it. I think he knew he'd get a$$ raped by the SS.

 

Nice kills my freind good job.

 

Pretty sad that camaro lost to a lightly modded v6 stang. Takes quite a bit of modding to take an eeven hasl assed V8. I know. i used to own a '00 v6 stang. Was slow until I put a blower on it.

 

Yah my dad has an 81 camaro Z28 with a 305 4spd and he owns IROC z's....he's not putting down alot of HP he only has headers the stock numbers are 165hp/245tq which i think its putting out more than that but no more that a Cobalt SS but cuz he always wanted to do a 350 swap but never did..its pretty much all original...like i said doesnt have alot of HP but the tranny that came with the car is bad ass and he just jumps on people from a stop thats where he wins most of his races

 

Any new Camaro SS would rape by a couple train legnths a stock Cobalt SS. Sorry to breat it to you.

 

He didn't say he tried to race a new Camaro SS

It was probably an 80's Camaro, in which case it would get its ass handed to it by an SS, as xavier said. Those things were complete dogs, even with a V8 and a 5-speed. The V8's were rated somewhere in the 165HP range, which is just pathetic for an 8 cylinder. The redline on those cars was also around 4500RPM, at which point the engine would completely run out of power, and in many cases end up spinning a bearing or self destructing in some way.

The only Camaros that pose a challenge are the 1993 and later models, which was when they switched to the new body style, and the Z/28 got the 275HP LT1 engine with the 6-speed manual. Any year Camaro with a V6 is an easy kill for an SS S/C, so they pose no threat

 

dont underestimate a 96-02 v6 f-body, with just a cam, gears, and an LSD, a buddy of mine was running 13 flats @105-106...that is until he sold his firebird. The 305 tbi/tpi cars were all dogs...now a bolton/tuned 350 TPI is able to run at least low 14's. The redline on the 350 i believe was around 6krpm, though you are right in that thier top end SUCKS. LT1's are quick, and dont even bother racin an LS1 unless you enjoy gettin butthurt or have some serious mods/traction. RWD>FWD.

 

I pretty much agree w/ everything you said... exept for the 13.0 @ ~106mph for the lightly modded V6. Considering they run low/mid 15's @ low 90's stock and the gears and LSD provide 0hp gain, he's not going to gain ~15mph in the 1/4 (low 90's mph to ~106mph) from just a cam. On the other hand, however, I disagree with the other guy that "no V6 Camaro is any threat to the SS" because a Y87 package 96-02 V6 Camaro, which includes 3.42 gears and LSD from the factory, are easy low-15 second cars w/ decent drivers STOCK. So, considering a significant percentage of SS's are running HIGH 14's and 15's, such a V6 Camaro could certainly get out to an early lead w/ a good launch and hold off the theoretically faster SS until right around the 1/4 sensors. Both the V6 Camaro's and Mustangs have a bad rep because there have been extremely slow ones in the past, but the 96+ Camaro's and 99+ Manual Mustangs are all capable of low 15's stock, and can dip into the 14's with good driving and conditions and a couple well-chosen mods such as rear-end gears. Then, and I will speak to the Mustang, it's either Heads/Cam/etc. N/A setup, with which people have gotten as much as 260whp+, or go F/I which the 3.8 takes to well... just like the 3.8L V6 Grand National. Just ask PhxSS, who owned a S/C V6 Mustang 2 cars prior to the SS.... or the unlucky few to meet a guy named Justin at the track, whose stock LONGBLOCK (heads/cam/internals/etc) V6 mustang runs 10.9's @ ~128 w/ a custom Twin-Turbo setup @ ~17psi.

Also, like chadder said, 350>>>>305. The 350 wasn't a bad car. Obviously the LT1's and LS1's are superior, but I've heard of 350's being DEEP in the 14's stock. Of course, current condition varies widely, but it also wouldn't take much for one to be significantly faster.

 

sorry, i forgot to tell you guys, the firebird guy has all boltons, a TC, and a tune (hptuners)

oh, and we have guys dipping into the high 13's with just boltons, a tune, and gears. Don't believe me? Go check out the timeslip page on http://www.fullthrottlev6.com/forums/timeslips.php? Look at Little G's time, thats just bolton's, gears, and a 5spd.

P.S. if ya wanna see a couple of near-stock with turbo #'s on the GM3800II, check out Tiago's website (a guy on LS1tech) www.force-fed-fabrications.com The L36, the 3800II, has a rev limiter in 4th gear at around 5000rpm, which is the limit of all of those dynos, so there is MUCH more power left in that car.

The GM 3800 is not to be confused with the Ford 3800, which is not as strong of a motor; the only reason the Ford's times are faster, is because there is such a HUGE mustang v6 community...the v6 f-body community is comparatively tiny, therefore there is more monetary support behind the 'Stang. All of the GM guys with lots of cash have the god motor'd cars, the LSX's, yeya!

OWND!

 

Yeah, I don't doubt that there's plenty of fast 3.8L Camaro's, I was just saying that he couldn't have gained 15mph from only a cam

BTW, I don't think you can definitively say that the Chevy 3.8 is "stronger" than the Ford 3.8. Both of them have made some serious numbers both N/A and F/I, and it's hard to convince people that one is better when the other one has the fastest cars. I definately don't have anything against the V6 Camaro... except maybe that for whatever reason most Camaro V6 owners absolutely hate Mustangs.... but I'm just saying that the claim that one is better is hard to prove given that they are so close in performance.

Anyway, what mods are you running and what are your track times? I've only seen 1 other V6 Camaro at the track when I was there and the only V6 Camaro site I knew about before now made it their job to make fun of Mustangs even though most of them were ignorant and had no clue about Mustangs at all.

Also, I should be putting in my P&P heads, cam, and RR's this weekend, so they'll be one more respectable V6 on the road in the near future.

 

BS..the v6 camaro will not run a 13 flat with those mods. maybe a mid-15. When i owned my '00 v6 stang, I never lost by more than a few inches when i raced v6 camaro's (when it was stock). I also raced a v6 firebird and v6 camaro at the track , and all of us ran pretty consisant numbers (16.0-16.2). we were all stock of course. So you think a measly cam, LSD and headers is going to drop 3 seconds off?

 

the block is stronger, the pistons are stronger, the injection system is better...lol...honestly I dont know all of the specifics, but i have even heard this from the mustang guys i hang out with. Buck for buck, the GM motor should be the more powerful of the two, (though not by much at all).

I have ABSOLUTELY nothing but respect for mustangs. They are our domestic bro's even though we are rivals. Though the A4 v6's are grandma slow... A buddy of mine just ran a 13.7@101 with a heads/intake (no cam) GT. It's really quick! He's planning a twin turbo setup with all forged internals/built up engine. He's hoping for around 750rwhp on street and nearly 1krwhp on track... and he WILL get it done some time or another.

I'm pretty much a near-stock bolton setup...lol, CAI, Lid, TSP Rumbler exhaust, Hypertech (which is soon going to be sold for HPTuners)...and thats pretty much it right now, and I havnt ran it at the track yet unfortunately...I hate throwin out unsupported numbers...but I think I can run a mid 9 1/8, and a very low 15 in 1/4, cause i beat a 92 sentra SE-R (my best friends car) by about 3-4 cars from a stop to a guesstimated 1/4 mile. and he ran a fastest of a 9.9 on the 1/8th...and I'm an A4, he's an M5. As far as future upgrades, i REALLY want a turbo..., but I'll probably end up goin the N/A route. GT2 or GT3 cam, Abbott stage 2 heads, HPTuners, custom long tubes, light weight 1.6 RR's, 3.73's, Zexel-Torsen LSD, and a Trans-go shift kit...thats about it, and will probably get me to AT LEAST 300rwhp. What are your current mods/times? Good to know there is another 6'er representative here

 

You are a moron . A v6 y87 camaro can run a really low 15, your 'buddys' cant drive worth crap. You obviously have NO IDEA how much a GT2 cam will wake up a v6 f-body. LOL MID 15's!!!????? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA yeah, mabe a 3.4L HAHAHAHAHAH, you are freakin retarded dude...seriously, check out the fullthrottlev6 timeslip page, or hell, even the firebirdv6.com timeslip page if it is still up

 

Well, I can't speak to which motor is literally stronger, but the STOCK LONGBLOCK (H/C/internals/everything) car w/ twin turbo is making over 500whp and nothing has broken so far, so whether one or the other is slightly stronger, they can both make some serious power.

Yeah, the A4 V6's are pretty dang slow... but I feel the same way about Camaros. They are technically rivals, but I'd much rather lose to a domestic or pull for the domestic in a race I'm not in than some guy who inevitably babbles on about hp/L when he loses to a "low tech" domestic. Not to say that all import guys are like that, as there are plenty of intelegent guys on both sides, but to say I'm tired of the HP/L argument would be a serious understatement

Sounds like some nice mods. What are the Flow numbers on those Abbott Heads? And what kind of cam specs do you guys use for all-out N/A setups?

In regard to my car... I ran 15.5@90 virtually stock.. actually probably slower than stock because all I had was GT take-off exhaust and Bullitt Wheels, which are much heavier than stock.... Not to mention it was my first time to the track and my 60' was 2.331 So, bring that down to a 2.2 flat like I've done more recently and I could have easily been in the low 15's... but since then, I haven't been to the track when it was cool (Dang FL weather), so I haven't beaten that time, though all I've added is a CAI really since then. So, I'm very lightly modded, but I'm thinking that good weather and driving will put me well into the 14's once I get the Heads/Cam/RR's in. It isn't a wild setup by any means, as I still need to drive this car every day.... but that's why I am soon starting a long-term project of a 10-11 second N/A Fox Body Mustang

 

Ok, first of all theres no need for name calling and all that crap. Its fine if you disagree with what he's saying, but at least try and keep it civil.

Second of all, I have no clue what this "Y87" Camaro V6 is that you speak of. As far as I know, no Camaro ever came with a V6 rated higher than 200HP. And thats the 3.8L, the older 3.4L was only rated at 160HP. You seem to be exaggerating a great deal. A 5-speed, V6 powered F-body with a professional driver will run a mid to low 15, at best. Thats at the limit, the stock car is not capable of going any faster in the 1/4 mile.

As somebody else already said, those numbers are way off, you're really not even in the ballpark.

Consider this: a stock, 6-speed LS1 Camaro making 325 underrated HP runs anywhere from a low-mid 13 second 1/4 mile stock. And thats of course with a good driver. Now you're going to sit there an tell us that a V6 model, making a measly 200HP (170 at the wheels) stock, with nothing but a cam, gears, and LSD, will run a 13.0 flat 1/4 mile at 105MPH?? Are you out of your mind??

Think about it logically - the only mod thats actually adding power would be the cam, the other two just help with acceleration/launch. Lets say the cam gave him 20HP at the wheels - he would be up to 190WHP. With a RWD vehicle weighing in at 3400lbs, that puts him at about a 15.0 flat. Factor in the gears and LSD, and the best he could possibly run would be a mid-high 14 second 1/4 mile, yet again if he was a skilled driver. I don't know where you pulled 13.0 @ 105-106 from, but thats complete Bull

 

isnt this a cobalt web site?? lol this aint fbody.com er what ever. so quit ur bytchin.

p.s. i do own a camaro....i just dont care

 

Chadder..V6 camaro's are weak, anemic cars, and you are the moron for thinking a ******* cam is goin to drop 3 seconds off the car. Buy a real car...Thank you

 

Fixed for humor...

 

mmk, yeah guys, im really honestly NOT KIDDING about anything i have said about the v6 f-body running a 13 flat...you guys can b!tch and moan about it not being logical, but like i said, just check out the timeslips page on www.fullthrottlev6.com i SWEAR TO GOD that Little G, who has NO power adders, just gears (and a little weight reduction ) is running a 13.6@96(i believe thats the right MPH)

a Y87 v6 f-body comes with 3.42:1 gears and a Eaton LSD, and are FULLY capable of running low 15's all day long.

ok, i see your argument here, he does have bolton's like I said, and a full bolton v6 can make around 185 to the wheels, now the hp #'s, +20hp, is VERY 'aneimic', that isnt even what the GT1 cam will give you. WickedSix, the Abbot sponsored car, made 225rwhp with boltons and JUST A CAM, he is making around 275 WITH HEADS....and that is only with the GT1 cam...the GT2 cam can make nearly 15-20 hp MORE than the GT1

here are the cam specs for the
GT1: 210°/210° at .050"
ˇ Intake Lift .317" (.507" lift at 1.6:1 rocker ratio)
ˇ Exhaust Lift .317" (.507" lift at 1.6:1 rocker ratio)
ˇ 113 LSA

GT2: *
216°/216° at .050"
Intake Lift .317" (.507" lift at 1.6:1 rocker ratio)
Exhaust Lift .317" (.507" lift at 1.6:1 rocker ratio)
111 Lobe Separation

GT3: 224°/224° at .050"
Intake Lift .335" (.536" lift at 1.6:1 rocker ratio)
Exhaust Lift .335" (.536" lift at 1.6:1 rocker ratio)
113 LSA

here's the website to get the head info http://www.abbottracingheads.com/

The reason the 'little, aneimic v6' is such a 'slacker' in performance is because of the stock cam, if you havnt realized this already.
dang, that is some brutal hp!!!! No one in the f-body community has a twin turbo setup, but that sounds FREAKIN AMAZING!!!! if you guys' longblocks are holding up that well to that much power, ours dang well sure will too!!!

oh, and the comment on the 'real car' thing i will ignore...

 

No one is saying that you can't make a v6 camaro or stang fast. I used to be "one of those people" and was ambitious about builidng up my stang. On a stock motor, with a blower, running 248rwhp, I was running low 14's. Capable of high 13's though. With that said, a stock motor with just a cam, and LSD, is not going to run 13's. you mentioned a weight reduction. Well, it must a be a carboard box after stripping it out if you're pulling those times with those minimal mods.

 

It's nice you posted all those facts but it wont do you any good here. The V6 f-body = teh gay in stock stock/mildly modded trim. You keep talkin about how it'll run 15's all day that'd be great if it was a civic,cobalt,cavalier,toyota and an assortment of other (compact,sport compact,economy) cars. The fact is it shouldn't even be associated with being fast.

 

That is an awesome story and i wish that stuff happened in my small town. Congrats on the victory dude.

 

OK, well that made no sense. You act like that would be impressive for those other cars, but not for the Camaro? Just because there are much FASTER Camaro's doesn't make it any less impressive to go from 15's to 13's N/A. Also, while the Camaro/Mustang V6's aren't in the same automotive class (Pony Cars vs. Economy Cars), they are certainly in the same PRICE class. I bought my 2000 V6 Mustang w/ just a couple thousand miles on it for $13k and over the last few years, the V6 Mustangs have been selling for ~$13k BRAND NEW. That throws it right in there w/ the other cars you mentioned... and guess what? It's one of the fastest, if not THE fastest of the cars in that price range. So, like the Cobalt SS, it may not be that fast compared to other Camaro's or Mustangs or whatever, but also like the Cobalt SS, it is a relatively fast car FOR THE MONEY.

 

that seems sad to me that you had a blower and only put down 248rwhp...our blower guys with prochargers and powerdynes are puttin down nearly 300rwhp...which is a 13sec car EASY. And sorry to break it to ya...it obviously doesnt even take an internal modification to run 13's in a v6 f-body... (a little weight reduction and lots of gear will go 13's)

You guys are all stuck up on HP!! Hp sells, tq wins races, and the 3.8's make LOTS of torque...yeah sure we only get 200 flywheel hp, but we also get 220 flywheel torque, which raises much more with boltons, and skyrockets with a cam.

oh and i agree with your last statement blainestang.