too bad you have to get it installed there also a video of it in action might be nice.

 

first buyer gets $500 off, damn thats a deal.

 

aint nothing like a tune for 900 dollars.

 

If you have the money for this setup, you should also set aside the money for all the suporting mods you will need to do. tires, clutch, axles (maybe) fuel return (maybe) then better suspension.. trans. mounts,. cat-back...Personally, I am also going to do at least pistons, cams,valves and head work. The list really never ends. Get ready to play with the big boys!

You also need to remember, not everything is about 1/4 mile times. Dont get me wrong. I go to the track once a month, and want nothing more than the fastest quarter mile time there. But I also would like it to be a beast on the street. (think Muscle Car!!)

Just my opinion. I do agree with you to a point about the horsepower coming in to quick but im sure that can be changed.

 

Once kits are shipping, there won't be the $900 charge for tunin and installtion. you can do the install yourself or have another shop do it. Shipping will run about $50. Dialing in the torque in 1st can be done in the PCM, in other gears with the M62 boost controller. This makes for a lot of higher gear grunt when cruising and not wanting to downshift.

The kit is bascially 3 grand, we're charging $900 for install and dyno tuning, the first buyer gets $500 off. these claims of the kit being 4k plus shipping and core are way off base.

 

3k is not bad at all

 

the intake wont work, and I didnt know the price was negotiable

 

So I should tell a company that i want a 100 dollar discount on 60lb injectors, because i have to buy credits to hptune the car if i install them?

 

The kit is about 3k and you get $500 off making it about 2500. We are charging $900 for the installation and tuning.
We dont' 'need' a car as we already own 2 test cars. We simply want to make sure our first customers have the tuning and support to maximize performance safely.

The kit has it's own intake and exhaust so you would not need your headers, downpipe, airbox, etc.

Claims of our kit being a bad deal because of supporting mods are leaving me dumbfounded. You guys are acting like a magic knob that could give 100HP for $10 would be a bad deal unless it included new tires, axles, a clutch and coupon to pay your first ticket. Isn't the entire idea of modding to make more power? What responsibility is it of a turbo manufacture to provide you support for things like extra gas you might use and new tires?

We have a rental car at ZZP for $19/day, a showroom with new leather couches, air hockey, a pool table, ice cream machine, bottled water, a TV, VCR and DVD player. We have a hotel arrangement at a local shop for $65/night.

 

Hm... forgot the whole part of not needing the intake. Silly turbo set-ups.

Makes the 3" CAI I bought rather moot....

Either way, once my credit cards are clear (end of the month) I'll be looking more seriously into this.... I can't decide between twinchargeing, get tuned for around 300whp, and voiding warrenty, or going custom tune, custom stage 2, full exhaust, supporting mods, and praying for 270whp.

I'm not the type to want to go the fastest. I just want a speedy little car.

Zoomer, is there any deal if you buy this kit and get the 3" exhaust?

 

i don't think the deal is bad however i do feel making an option of a base tune might help ..

3K really isn't bad esp for the numbers you cranked out.. you guys are forgetting that your going to need to pay someone to tune it.. unless everyone owns hptuners.. which making a shop tune it will be at least 400 bux.. an individual is still gonna be like 250 and they might not know wtf they're doing people need to stop bitching about every little thing.. this is definitely a good deal and decent alternative to everything out there.. how much power does the harropp blower make again? how much does it cost? jeez it's the people that are bitching that are the reason we don't have a big aftermarket.. you cheap asses don't want to pay for things to be done right..

you want something done inexpensively engineer it all yourself and go custom adn face possible reliability issues.. you want it done right trust it to a company.. don't like those options.. then stfu


/rant

 

Yep like he said ^
also its about 3125 for everything what i figured up, and i did see something about a base tune so that would get you started.
I think thats about right and for everything you get. I will have it just dont know when now i started buying other things so i will have to raise a bit more till i can go forward with the purchase but there not shipping yet anyway.

 

for now im leaning towards hahn, zoomer do u have more information? technical information? IATS, mpg effects, relability...

 

between this thread and the other thread where the guy was bitching about the price of turboing these cars..

yo guys do realize a good turbo as about 600 bux right at the minimum? plus 300-400 for a manifold... **** adds up ..

 

I think its still to early to answer those questions correctly. I would think thats why there doing the install and tuning the first few kits sold. Also maybe to do up the manual for the kit i dont know tho.

 

Reliability is going to be based on boost level. With the grades of materials and components we use everything but the turbo should last forever.
IATs hit 140 with 25psi but that is going to be dependent on outside temps, boost level, length of time at WOT, etc. MPG would be higher than a supercharged setup.

If our kit is a grand cheaper than Hahn, I'm curious as to what we need to change here?? What would make you lean in that direction?

 

dont get me wrong the price is perfect. personally i think the eatons are junk and 140 IATs is not low. match that up with 90-100 degree summer weather and humidity, not only will u heat soak, but those IAT will go up much more.

i love the tq line and power, but how much tq can a cobalt land sub 4000k rpm and actually get grip without running full slicks? im running 215lb tq, on street drags, with solid motor and trans mounts, and ur still going to spin down low, now imagine adding another 120tq? thats insane.

i think i would just be more comfortable with the hahn only pushing 80 degree IATs all day long.

your also keeping the highly restrictve intake manifold. the reason people were toasting engines left and right is because of high IAT's from the eaton and poor fuel delievery from the 42lb injectors.

i love the way ur thinking and the setup is impressive, but the relability seems to be on the iffy side.

 

$1999.99 for the following:
304 stainless steel T3 turbo manifold with wastegate flange
2.5" 304 stainless steel 5 bolt turbo downpipe
Oil feed and return system
304 Stainless wastegate dump pipe
Custom MAF solution
Air/air intercooler with custom mounting brackets
Custom charge air tubing
2 manual boost controllers
Intake tubing and filter
Silicone vacuum tubing
14 Clampco T-bolts
Turbonetics silicone boots
Custom PCM tuned for your make/model
-Then we add the borg warner turbo, TiAL bov, TiAL waste gate, installation and tune by zzp.
1,999.99+675.00+225.00+225.00+900.00=$4024.99
Now, unless those little "+" signs in the option boxes mean something else, I'm taking it that you add the cost of each component to the $1999.99 am I wrong?

In my case, it's this because I don't have an extra turbo, bov, and waste gate lying around:
1,999.99+100.00(core charge)+675.00(turbo)+225.00(bov)+225.00(waste gate)+50.00(SHIPPING)= #3274.99 *PLUS THE ADDITIONAL COST OF HAVING THE SYSTEM RUN ON THE DYNO

Respectfully, I am in no means complaining and have full intentions of buying the kit. I'm just merely confused about how you're saying this is a $3K kit whenever I am figuring otherwise. Your $3K isn't including the turbo, bov, and waste gate? just the base kit, install, and dyno? That is an incomplete kit. $3K for the person who has his/her own turbo, waste gate, and bov, or for the person who installs and tunes themselves.

 

You couldn't twin charge a GTP without some SERIOUS intercooling.

 

there is slot of bitching about prices here but you have to remember the cobalt is a sport compact car mostly little kids buy them its usually there first new car and they can't afford most stuff for them. Also most of the kids here havnt done full builds on real performance cars and have no idea they have been doing bolt ons only and need to learn hp costs money

 

ZZP has been doing it for years. Never looked at the kits I'm sure they do have some cooling modifications

 

Running 25 psi adds 170F to a system with 100% efficiency. Figure a turbo at say 77% efficiency (which is being optimistic) and you're adding 221 deg F to the ambient temperature.

If you're technical you can do the math and learn the formulas here: http://www.progl.com/General/Boost&heat.htm

Now let's assume that it's 70 deg outside. If you had an intake to the turbo drawing in air with zero temp gain (impossible) you would still start with 291 deg pre intercooler temperature. But with the filter under the hood, this is more realistically going to add 10-50 deg to the draw in air making your pre-intercooler temperatures well over 300 deg. If, in that scenereo, you were told that with a passive air/air intercooler system the IATs were under 100 deg, the person speaking would be mistaken or lying. If you believed them it would only be because you don't understand the laws of thermodynamics.

Now on a turbo system there are ways to maximize performance. Isolating the draw in air, matching your turbo to maximize efficiency, running a larger intercooler, running dual intercoolers or active cooling. However, breaking the laws of thermodynamics isn't one of them. I will admit that our testing, done on a dyno with repeated pulls, limited air cooling and no measurement of IC coolant temps was a poor way to determine IATs. I probably shouldn't have reported them and given better real world numbers with street driving. If people do not understand thermodynamics and what is and isn't possible though, then our data won't matter...

 

great post zoomer many people don't take this into consideration

 

gotta say that a nice kit and the price isn't to bad either.

 

This is cobaltss.net your talking to. you left more people puzzled with your explanation than there where before, just rate it on a scale of . cool warm hot.